Brexit Oven Ready Deal burnt to a crisp

tangerinenotorange said:
Do you know what it says? Seems the OP and half the posters on here are experts on something they know nothing about. Same as usual I suppose.
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The text is not in the public domain at present, but “you know who 😉” is briefing the RW media that the U.K. is going to flick two fingers to the EU. So you have to take him at his word surely?

Of course it’s entirely possible Johnson is playing to the gallery and lying to the ERG, and all of this is just designed to enable a climb down to be dressed up as a victory.

Bit like when the Government caved in and signed the Withdrawal Agreement in the first place.
 
Mexboroseasider said:
The text is not in the public domain at present, but “you know who 😉” is briefing the RW media that the U.K. is going to flick two fingers to the EU. So you have to take him at his word surely?

Of course it’s entirely possible Johnson is playing to the gallery and lying to the ERG, and all of this is just designed to enable a climb down to be dressed up as a victory.
Bit like when the Government caved in and signed the Withdrawal Agreement in the first place.
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Or maybe Boris has had enough of the EU's prevaricating and has decided to up the ante. Maybe Frost is getting nothing back from Barnier and is looking for Ursula to take over the reins when the full implications of the EU's intransigence hits home. Maybe Boris is giving an ultimatum that either progress is made by 15 October or we call off the talks.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
Or maybe Boris has had enough of the EU's prevaricating and has decided to up the ante. Maybe Frost is getting nothing back from Barnier and is looking for Ursula to take over the reins when the full implications of the EU's intransigence hits home. Maybe Boris is giving an ultimatum that either progress is made by 15 October or we call off the talks.
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Johnson is definitely trying to bring in Ursula. And also the EU leaders.

And I think the EU probably, possibly, maybe, realise that?

And I expect it’ll work like a dream. After all we were told in 2016 that “they need us more than we need them. Haw haw haw!!!”.

And everything since then has shown just how right that statement was after all.

Corking stuff.
 
Wasn't the original story in the Financial Times? It's not like them to stir up any anti-Brexit feeling.
It's remarkable how some assume this country is behaving in one way and the EU in another. It's as if the closed Schengen borders, the refusal to sell health equipment to other EU members and the wholly illegal - but Commission sanctioned - bailout of national airlines never happened.
 
Its all rubbish anyway, under the terms of the Withdrawal Agreement itself it contains a clause that the WA - that Johnson himself signed off - remains Supreme regardless of what changes the UK (or EU) make and British Courts would have to accept the ruling made by the ECJ.

The whole subterfuge is merely to garner opinion on how much support is out there for crashing talks and heading to a No Deal - apparently not much according to a YOUGOV poll which has 50% of respondents saying “Leaving Without A Trade Deal” is a Bad Outcome and 24% saying it would be a Good Outcome.

Painting the EU as the villains of the piece is all they have left because as we all know, with this Government everything is always someone else’s fault!
 
Bottle said:
Its all rubbish anyway, under the terms of the Withdrawal Agreement itself it contains a clause that the WA - that Johnson himself signed off - remains Supreme regardless of what changes the UK (or EU) make and British Courts would have to accept the ruling made by the ECJ.

The whole subterfuge is merely to garner opinion on how much support is out there for crashing talks and heading to a No Deal - apparently not much according to a YOUGOV poll which has 50% of respondents saying “Leaving Without A Trade Deal” is a Bad Outcome and 24% saying it would be a Good Outcome.

Painting the EU as the villains of the piece is all they have left because as we all know, with this Government everything is always someone else’s fault!
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And having put a toe in the water and found it to be rather chilly, I expect there’ll be a lot of “Wazzam!! We were only ever tidying up the colons and commas in that Act of Parliament old bean. Never intended to pull a fast one if we thought we could get away with it - jeepers; is that Carrie calling? Must dash vavavoom!! Bunga Bunga!!!”
 
Mexboroseasider said:
And having put a toe in the water and found it to be rather chilly, I expect there’ll be a lot of “Wazzam!! We were only ever tidying up the colons and commas in that Act of Parliament old bean. Never intended to pull a fast one if we thought we could get away with it - jeepers; is that Carrie calling? Must dash vavavoom!! Bunga Bunga!!!”
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So you’re right if you’re right and you’re right if you’re wrong.

Congratulations 👍
 
“Completely incompetent AND completely dishonest“, ElBurro. The buffoon makes statements all the time which are without foundation and expects us to believe them! For example, the economy will bounce back quickly; no evidence that face masks are effective; we have plenty of PPE; the crisis will be all over by Christmas; we will have a World beating track and trace system AND the “Oven-Ready” deal on Brexit. There are numerous other examples.
The man is worse than Trump!
 
Blackpool voted overwhelmingly for BREXIT. So if you are a exiled Remoaner wingeing on in poxy little st.albans or mexborough or peeling spuds in a pie and mash caff in Millwall no one gives a feck.😀😀😀😀😀🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
 
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It is as simple as this.
Boris Johnson needs someone to blame for his laziness and incompetence.
This week it is the EU. Last week it was refugees.
Next week it will be someone else's fault.
The right wing press have turned into his Orwellian Ministry of Truth.
As long as this government remains in power no other nation can trust the UK.
 
catinstalbans said:
It is as simple as this.
Boris Johnson needs someone to blame for his laziness and incompetence.
This week it is the EU. Last week it was refugees.
Next week it will be someone else's fault.
The right wing press have turned into his Orwellian Ministry of Truth.
As long as this government remains in power no other nation can trust the UK.
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You're barking into an echo chamber of fanaticism and nonsense. Instead of luxuriating in your inability to embrace democracy go outside, take a few deep breaths, rid yourself of your incessant vitriolic outpourings and think about how you can play a positive part in this brave new chapter for your country.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
You're barking into an echo chamber of fanaticism and nonsense. Instead of luxuriating in your inability to embrace democracy go outside, take a few deep breaths, rid yourself of your incessant vitriolic outpourings and think about how you can play a positive part in this brave new chapter for your country.
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I am afraid you are most probably the extremist in this scenario TNO.
 
I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge 😉

This is about forcing the EU to consider putting a border between Northern Ireland and Ireland which the Tory’s, and they know they cannot do.

They are effectively turning the Irish problem on its head and making the EU responsible.

The EU treasures it’s borders and we know they cannot have an open border with the UK as they currently do without a proper deal.

With this new legislation the Tory’s are pretty much saying there will be little checks on anything between Northern Ireland and the mainland - which in current form leaves the EU border open.

Hence the Tory’s are forcIng the issue, which will probably end up with some form of trade agreement - which solves the Irish border problem.
 
seasideone said:
I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge 😉

This is about forcing the EU to consider putting a border between Northern Ireland and Ireland which the Tory’s, and they know they cannot do.

They are effectively turning the Irish problem on its head and making the EU responsible.

The EU treasures it’s borders and we know they cannot have an open border with the UK as they currently do without a proper deal.

With this new legislation the Tory’s are pretty much saying there will be little checks on anything between Northern Ireland and the mainland - which in current form leaves the EU border open.

Hence the Tory’s are forcIng the issue, which will probably end up with some form of trade agreement - which solves the Irish border problem.
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So, a kinda cross between Lytham Kev and Mystic Meg then?

Still, it`s reassuring to know that such momentous decisions are not being blabbed to all and sundry...😉
 
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BFC_BFC_BFC said:
So you’re right if you’re right and you’re right if you’re wrong.

Congratulations 👍
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😂 And now Johnson is in trouble with the ERG for claiming they aren’t ripping up the Withdrawal Agreement - just clarifying a few minor issues.

Tsk - he can’t do right for doing wrong. Poor Boris.
 
seasideone said:
I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge 😉

This is about forcing the EU to consider putting a border between Northern Ireland and Ireland which the Tory’s, and they know they cannot do.

They are effectively turning the Irish problem on its head and making the EU responsible.

The EU treasures it’s borders and we know they cannot have an open border with the UK as they currently do without a proper deal.

With this new legislation the Tory’s are pretty much saying there will be little checks on anything between Northern Ireland and the mainland - which in current form leaves the EU border open.

Hence the Tory’s are forcIng the issue, which will probably end up with some form of trade agreement - which solves the Irish border problem.
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I suspect that’s certainly part of what’s going on.

I recall when May’s backstop was all the rage one thing Brexiter politicos kept saying “well you put up a hard border if you want; we aren’t”.

That’s all fine and dandy but what I never understood was how, in the event of no deal, the UK could comply with its obligations to the WTO without checks on goods.
 
seasideone said:
I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge 😉

This is about forcing the EU to consider putting a border between Northern Ireland and Ireland which the Tory’s, and they know they cannot do.

They are effectively turning the Irish problem on its head and making the EU responsible.

The EU treasures it’s borders and we know they cannot have an open border with the UK as they currently do without a proper deal.

With this new legislation the Tory’s are pretty much saying there will be little checks on anything between Northern Ireland and the mainland - which in current form leaves the EU border open.

Hence the Tory’s are forcIng the issue, which will probably end up with some form of trade agreement - which solves the Irish border problem.
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So its Theresa May's deal then. But I thought that was crap and Boris's was great. I am confused now.
 
seasideone said:
I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge 😉

This is about forcing the EU to consider putting a border between Northern Ireland and Ireland which the Tory’s, and they know they cannot do.

They are effectively turning the Irish problem on its head and making the EU responsible.

The EU treasures it’s borders and we know they cannot have an open border with the UK as they currently do without a proper deal.

With this new legislation the Tory’s are pretty much saying there will be little checks on anything between Northern Ireland and the mainland - which in current form leaves the EU border open.

Hence the Tory’s are forcIng the issue, which will probably end up with some form of trade agreement - which solves the Irish border problem.
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It also scuppers a US trade deal as Democrats in Congress say they will never ratify a UK trade deal that breaks the GFA. So that's a good thing.
 
The flapping you hear in No. 10 is the noise of chickens coming home to roost.

Johnson signed up to the EU`s state aid regulations as part of the deal to allow for friction less trade between NI with the European bloc, and to avoid a border on the island of Ireland. Any future plans to regenerate the economy using state aid will be hampered by the agreement he signed as subsidies will affect trade between GB and the EU. He is now making unseemly noises about reneging on the deal and trying to shift blame; you can understand why the EU would be annoyed.

The border issue was always going to come back and bite him...
 
spudgun said:
So, a kinda cross between Lytham Kev and Mystic Meg then?

Still, it`s reassuring to know that such momentous decisions are not being blabbed to all and sundry...😉
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I challenge you to find ANY post I have ever made regarding a prediction or ITK info about our great leader that was wrong - reality is you cannot 👍👍
 
bollieboy said:
So its Theresa May's deal then. But I thought that was crap and Boris's was great. I am confused now.
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There has never been a trade deal, all they ever agreed was the transition period and some behaviours afterwards.

The whole thing is a mess!!!
 
seasideone said:
I challenge you to find ANY post I have ever made regarding a prediction or ITK info about our great leader - reality is you cannot 👍👍
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On this thread you posted “I’m going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge”.

I suspect in the post I’ve just replied to you’ve missed out the words “which was wrong”?
 
seasideone said:
I challenge you to find ANY post I have ever made regarding a prediction or ITK info about our great leader - reality is you cannot 👍👍
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My post doesn`t cast any aspersions on the validity of your information Seaside, just a little little hearted joshing on your phrase: " I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge." Hence the references to Meg and Kev.

I`m quite happy to believe Johnson is constantly texting you (or delegating it to others) with updates on Britain`s future strategies regarding negotiations with the EU...👍😀
 
spudgun said:
My post doesn`t cast any aspersions on the validity of your information Seaside, just a little little hearted joshing on your phrase: " I am going to make a prediction with some inside knowledge." Hence the references to Meg and Kev.

I`m quite happy to believe Johnson is constantly texting you (or delegating it to others) with updates on Britain`s future strategies regarding negotiations with the EU...👍😀
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A very good friend of mine knows him and his family very very well.
 
I’m sure Boris spends his evenings chatting through the finer detail of his Brexit negotiations and government policy with his mate, who then passes that on verbatim to his other mates for them to publish on various Internet forums.

I mean don’t we all!!!
 
I don t know why you are all getting so het up about Brexit and the F.T.A. negotiations at the end of the day the north of England will remain deprived whilst the south east will prosper it has been the same under both Labour & Tory governments whilst we have been members of the E.U.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
I’m sure Boris spends his evenings chatting through the finer detail of his Brexit negotiations and government policy with his mate, who then passes that on verbatim to his other mates for them to publish on various Internet forums.

I mean don’t we all!!!
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As I have said many times, I have always been right when posting about Boris and his clan - ALWAYS - and it’s always stuff not in the public domain 👍👍
 
I’m not sure anyone, including yourself, have fact checked anything you’ve said, so I’m not convinced.

It’s all a bit my mates mum is the window cleaner at a garage where the owners sister once met the gardner who bought some bedding plants off the second cousin of a bloke from the pub who once caught a glance of a young lady who spent some time in the company of Boris’ ex-dinner lady.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
I’m not sure anyone, including yourself, have fact checked anything you’ve said, so I’m not convinced.

It’s all a bit my mates mum is the window cleaner at a garage where the owners sister once met the gardner who bought some bedding plants off the second cousin of a bloke from the pub who once caught a glance of a young lady who spent some time in the company of Boris’ ex-dinner lady.
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You know him as well?
 
Looks like someone who has seen the detail isn't happy about it. Head of the Government's legal Department is resigning:

Reporting the news of Sir Jonathan's resignation, the Financial Times attributed the move to "suggestions that Boris Johnson is trying to row back on parts of last year's Brexit deal relating to Northern Ireland".

It added that people "close to Sir Jonathan said he was 'very unhappy' about the decision to overwrite parts of the Northern Ireland protocol, part of the 2019 withdrawal agreement, with new powers in the UK internal market bill."

In response to Sir Jonathan's resignation, the shadow attorney general, Lord Falconer, said he was "an impressive lawyer and a loyal civil servant".

"If he can't stay in public service, there must be something very rotten about this government. This resignation indicates that senior government lawyers think that the government is about to break the law."
 
If I was reading between the lines here...

Boris and Co are likely looking to angle whatever they can to try and leverage the negotiations.

As ever, there’s a few sticklers, who don’t understand how to play the game and get all OCD, when games need to be played.

By the looks of it Jones is one such stickler...

The important thing is the deal (or not) that eventually is agreed. The way we get there is largely irrelevant. One thing is for certain, playing by the ‘rules’ is all very predictable and unlikely to gain any initiative.
 
I feel great sympathy for anyone who knows “the Bumbling, lazy oaf” and his family very very well, such that he is prepared to divulge information to them! Personally, I would not cross the street to extinguish him if he was on fire!
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
I’m not sure anyone, including yourself, have fact checked anything you’ve said, so I’m not convinced.

It’s all a bit my mates mum is the window cleaner at a garage where the owners sister once met the gardner who bought some bedding plants off the second cousin of a bloke from the pub who once caught a glance of a young lady who spent some time in the company of Boris’ ex-dinner lady.
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As they say BFC x 3 you are rightly entitled to believe what you want 👍

It does not make you or anyone else for that matter correct though.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
If I was reading between the lines here...

Boris and Co are likely looking to angle whatever they can to try and leverage the negotiations.

As ever, there’s a few sticklers, who don’t understand how to play the game and get all OCD, when games need to be played.

By the looks of it Jones is one such stickler...

The important thing is the deal (or not) that eventually is agreed. The way we get there is largely irrelevant. One thing is for certain, playing by the ‘rules’ is all very predictable and unlikely to gain any initiative.
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What do you expect from the Legal Department of the Government? That's not being a stickler, that's advising to stay within legal guidelines. Clearly, his advice has been ignored.
 
Wizaard said:
What do you expect from the Legal Department of the Government? That's not being a stickler, that's advising to stay within legal guidelines. Clearly, his advice has been ignored.
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Nah... I’ve worked with these types before. They’re OK when it comes to working within their pre-programmed parameters, but lack the flexibility/ingenuity required to get deals done.

If you’re not pushing the legal boundaries and stretching the realms of acceptability, then you’re not going to get the best deal.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Nah... I’ve worked with these types before. They’re OK when it comes to working within their pre-programmed parameters, but lack the flexibility/ingenuity required to get deals done.

If you’re not pushing the legal boundaries and stretching the realms of acceptability, then you’re not going to get the best deal.
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I once knew a lawyer who had so much flexibility and ingenuity that he got himself struck off. 😂
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
I’m sure there’s plenty of them, but that’s not really the point.
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I thinks it’s precisely the point. Brandon Lewis has just admitted that Johnson’s plan to override the withdrawal agreement breaks international law ie the treaty Johnson signed up to back in January.

The Civil Servant who resigned obviously thinks people, but especially government ministers, shouldn’t break the law. Good lad. His mum and dad obviously brought him up proper 👍
 
The other thing that people seem to be missing is that, if enacted, the result of this government plan could see a return to the troubles in Northern Ireland. This isn't idle speculation, it is a real possibility.
 
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