Keir Starmer fully confident re Rayner

Bend it like Suddick said:
Im actually looking forward to Labours next tenure, because if you think this Government has been a car crash, just wait for Starmer's lot to get started...it's going to be fun. Feel free to bookmark it.
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I don't think 'looking forward' is the right expression Bend it. I'm struggling to see any leadership qualities in Starmer or indeed any qualities at all in the current shadow cabinet.
 
tommytwojags said:
I don't think 'looking forward' is the right expression Bend it. I'm struggling to see any leadership qualities in Starmer or indeed any qualities at all in the current shadow cabinet.
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You won't see anything if you're refusing to look. Start by concentrating on the shambles that is the current Government then get Labour in and see how they do.
 
It’s said that labour will scrap right to buy tenants council houses which is sensible because we need a much bigger council house base, wait a minute didn’t AR buy hers at a discount then sell to make a great profit 🤨
 
1966_and_all_that said:
You won't see anything if you're refusing to look. Start by concentrating on the shambles that is the current Government then get Labour in and see how they do.
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All too often, elections are decided because voters are unhappy with the party in power. That shouldn't be a reason. If Labour has something to offer the country to make it better, let the party say what it is. All I'm getting at the moment is unlikely looking shadow cabinet members and a shadow leader who changes his mind to suit whatever situation he is in.
 
tommytwojags said:
All too often, elections are decided because voters are unhappy with the party in power. That shouldn't be a reason. If Labour has something to offer the country to make it better, let the party say what it is. All I'm getting at the moment is unlikely looking shadow cabinet members and a shadow leader who changes his mind to suit whatever situation he is in.
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So are you happy with the way the last 14 years have gone? Is it still a work in progress and they deserve more time?

And before you say pandemic and Ukraine, what were they doing for 10 years before that?
 
1966_and_all_that said:
You won't see anything if you're refusing to look. Start by concentrating on the shambles that is the current Government then get Labour in and see how they do.
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The current government is a shambles, however two wrongs don’t make a right - and if she is guilty she should not be anywhere near government, parliament or power!!
 
seasideone said:
The current government is a shambles, however two wrongs don’t make a right - and if she is guilty she should not be anywhere near government, parliament or power!!
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Mine was in response to TTJ's assertion about there being no talent in the shadow cabinet. I was not commenting on Ms Rayner's issue.
 
This utter garbage re Raynor is just that, desperate right wing sleazeballs trying to distract from the many many failings of their own. FFS they're still wanging on about beergate the pathetic cretins. There's nothing to see here she did exactly what you or I would have done and gamed the system, perfectly legally, to her advantage. The tory list of genuinely breaking the law continues unabated as they have forgotten entirely that the law applies to them too. The fact that I'd like to give her a good rousting has no relevance to this matter.
 
bill40 said:
This utter garbage re Raynor is just that, desperate right wing sleazeballs trying to distract from the many many failings of their own. FFS they're still wanging on about beergate the pathetic cretins. There's nothing to see here she did exactly what you or I would have done and gamed the system, perfectly legally, to her advantage. The tory list of genuinely breaking the law continues unabated as they have forgotten entirely that the law applies to them too. The fact that I'd like to give her a good rousting has no relevance to this matter.
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Are you fine with Rishis wife ‘gaming the system’ and saving multi millions in tax?
 
bill40 said:
This utter garbage re Raynor is just that, desperate right wing sleazeballs trying to distract from the many many failings of their own. FFS they're still wanging on about beergate the pathetic cretins. There's nothing to see here she did exactly what you or I would have done and gamed the system, perfectly legally, to her advantage. The tory list of genuinely breaking the law continues unabated as they have forgotten entirely that the law applies to them too. The fact that I'd like to give her a good rousting has no relevance to this matter.
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Desperate politicians and newspaper editors are more than prepared to talk up minor issues if they think it will aid their pitiful cause.
 
1966_and_all_that said:
One games the system to the tune of multi-millions and the other seeks finance and legal advice to ensure that she's doing the right thing in saving £1,500.
Next you'll be saying that the principle's exactly the same.
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Not necessarily - What Rishi’s wife did was legal - who knows about AR!?
 
From the Times article:

A spokesman for Rayner said at the weekend: “Angela has always made clear she also spent time at her husband’s property when they had children and got married, as he did at hers. The house she owned remained her main home.

Why is she lying when it's so obvious that she's lying, what is she trying to hide?
 
Lost Seasider said:
From the Times article:

A spokesman for Rayner said at the weekend: “Angela has always made clear she also spent time at her husband’s property when they had children and got married, as he did at hers. The house she owned remained her main home.

Why is she lying when it's so obvious that she's lying, what is she trying to hide?
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You really do like to be judge, jury and executioner, don't you? The poster who is forever saying "source" 🤣 The poster who is always telling us Mone is innocent as not charged, despite her also being under police investigation. Mone, if you recall, is under investigation for £220M, AR for maybe £1500. A story being run by a billionnaire who doesn't pay any tax in the UK 🤣

How's the Wragg security investigation getting on, by the way? You know, a real blackmail risk to the UK, are the Times reporting on that ? How's the reporting of what JRM has called Gerrymandering coming along, stopping the electorate voting? What about Rishi's links to contract given to his wife, and her links through Infosys to Fujitsu? What about Rishi's shares in Moderna, bought before that huge contract for vaccines when he was Chancellor? And I haven't seen anything about the Sunaks both being US permannent residents, granted while he was, checks notes, UK Chancellor, and having to pay taxes there.

But, but, but Angela Rayner 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
 
Tangerinemoss said:
You really do like to be judge, jury and executioner, don't you? The poster who is forever saying "source" 🤣 The poster who is always telling us Mone is innocent as not charged, despite her also being under police investigation. Mone, if you recall, is under investigation for £220M, AR for maybe £1500. A story being run by a billionnaire who doesn't pay any tax in the UK 🤣

How's the Wragg security investigation getting on, by the way? You know, a real blackmail risk to the UK, are the Times reporting on that ? How's the reporting of what JRM has called Gerrymandering coming along, stopping the electorate voting? What about Rishi's links to contract given to his wife, and her links through Infosys to Fujitsu? What about Rishi's shares in Moderna, bought before that huge contract for vaccines when he was Chancellor? And I haven't seen anything about the Sunaks both being US permannent residents, granted while he was, checks notes, UK Chancellor, and having to pay taxes there.

But, but, but Angela Rayner 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
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I do not like what is going on in UK politics and have zero time for the current conservate government, however I want honest politicians and if she has deliberately lied about anything like this, she has to go. Time will tell.

Two wrongs do not make a right though!
 
Lost Seasider said:
From the Times article:

A spokesman for Rayner said at the weekend: “Angela has always made clear she also spent time at her husband’s property when they had children and got married, as he did at hers. The house she owned remained her main home.

Why is she lying when it's so obvious that she's lying, what is she trying to hide?
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Why on Gods Planet would anybody spend time in two separate houses when they are just married...really?
That's bad enough, but when the houses are about a mile in distance from each other...pull another one Gobby

If you are innocent, show the letter exonerating you, and also tell Captain Hindsight that pretending not to know the details is pathetic as he's done it before and it doesn't wash with most people with some modicum of intelligence.
 
tommytwojags said:
That was when it was just an alleged tax offence concerning a false declaration about where Rayner's residence was. Now, apparently, there is a number of other issues being investigated.
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There are now at least 12 officers assigned to the case. Good job there's no other crime going on in the Manchester area. Great prioritisation and not at all disproportionate.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Why on Gods Planet would anybody spend time in two separate houses when they are just married...really?
That's bad enough, but when the houses are about a mile in distance from each other...pull another one Gobby
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Especially when there are young children involved.

What I don't get is what is she trying to hide? If it was just the CGT then that could be written off as an honest mistake, if it's electoral then that's time-barred and nobody cares anyway, so why are they allowing this to drag on and on?

Is it undeclared rent on the property? Is it some kind of council tax fraud? Is it some other kind of fraud?
 
Wizaard said:
There are now at least 12 officers assigned to the case. Good job there's no other crime going on in the Manchester area. Great prioritisation and not at all disproportionate.
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Total overkill Wiz, Im also surprised there hasn't been any mention of an in depth investigation by HM Taxes and Revenues
 
Lost Seasider said:
HMRC has a duty to keep taxpayers affairs secret, even if they're under investigation, they take that very seriously.
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Because a leak would never come out of Tory HQ that could potentially be damaging to Labour in the run up to a General Election...
 
seasideone said:
I do not like what is going on in UK politics and have zero time for the current conservate government, however I want honest politicians and if she has deliberately lied about anything like this, she has to go. Time will tell.

Two wrongs do not make a right though!
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I agree 100%, but am just flagging the imbalance in reporting something minor compared to the huge wrongs of the current Government, industrial scale dishonesty, in which the media appear to have little interest.

Many flagged months ago that the Right Wing media would raise hundreds of red herrings, trying to convince the electorate that Labour are as bad as the Tories. It does disturb me that the Police seem in thrall to them, 12 officers?? What is the worst she can have done, CGT tax of a few thousand, electoral law broken, now out of time limit? 12 officers for that?? Maybe it will come out that she was a mass murderer??
 
Tangerinemoss said:
I agree 100%, but am just flagging the imbalance in reporting something minor compared to the huge wrongs of the current Government, industrial scale dishonesty, in which the media appear to have little interest.

Many flagged months ago that the Right Wing media would raise hundreds of red herrings, trying to convince the electorate that Labour are as bad as the Tories. It does disturb me that the Police seem in thrall to them, 12 officers?? What is the worst she can have done, CGT tax of a few thousand, electoral law broken, now out of time limit? 12 officers for that?? Maybe it will come out that she was a mass murderer??
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So if 1500 is not enough to bother about but the Tory millions are - where is the line for you?

Mine is zero!
 
James Daly's "performance" on Sky News this morning was excruciating. He's written to GM Police asking them to investigate, but won't (when asked) tell anyone what it is he's asking them to investigate. He also gave the impression that he hadn't been expecting to be asked the question - he certainly floundered when it came.
 
Lost Seasider said:
The latest thinking is it's not the CGT she has to worry about, it's the right to buy discount that should've been repaid that's the killer, and the fact that she falsified her entry on the electoral register makes it look like a deliberate fraud rather than a simple mistake.

I also wonder if she declared any rents received from her brother whilst he was letting the place, because, again, that's not something that can be explained as a "mistake".

Finally, if it was just the CGT, the sensible thing to would be to admit the mistake, pay the small amount of tax, publish the "advice" and then move on, the fact that she's not doing this suggests (strongly) that she has something much more serious to hide.

This isn't going away.
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Did she? That seemed very factual or appallingly written.
 
seasideone said:
So if 1500 is not enough to bother about but the Tory millions are - where is the line for you?

Mine is zero!
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I agree at zero, but am pxssed off with the millions which are not getting 12 officers working on them. How many are working on Rishi and his wife? Anyone bothered we have an American citizen as PM?
 
Tangerinemoss said:
I agree at zero, but am pxssed off with the millions which are not getting 12 officers working on them. How many are working on Rishi and his wife? Anyone bothered we have an American citizen as PM?
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He is not a US citizen and that’s wrong to say that.

He held/has a green guard which allows him to live and work there which is very different.

He and his wife hasn’t broken the law as far as I know, well put it this way - nobody has reported it in all seriousness.

So it’s very different.
 
seasideone said:
He is not a US citizen and that’s wrong to say that.

He held/has a green guard which allows him to live and work there which is very different.

He and his wife hasn’t broken the law as far as I know, well put it this way - nobody has reported it in all seriousness.

So it’s very different.
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Ah, this is where it gets interesting. Green Cards are a temporary thing, but, whilst he was Chancellor, he was awarded permanent status. This means he can both stay indefiniotely without a green card, and also means he has to pay US tax on all his income from anywhere in the world. I wonder if this is the first time a UK Prime Minister has paid US tax?
 
Tangerinemoss said:
Ah, this is where it gets interesting. Green Cards are a temporary thing, but, whilst he was Chancellor, he was awarded permanent status. This means he can both stay indefiniotely without a green card, and also means he has to pay US tax on all his income from anywhere in the world. I wonder if this is the first time a UK Prime Minister has paid US tax?
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Boris was born in the US.
 
Tangerinemoss said:
Ah, this is where it gets interesting. Green Cards are a temporary thing, but, whilst he was Chancellor, he was awarded permanent status. This means he can both stay indefiniotely without a green card, and also means he has to pay US tax on all his income from anywhere in the world. I wonder if this is the first time a UK Prime Minister has paid US tax?
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He also returned his green card in 2021.
 
Tangerinemoss said:
Ah, this is where it gets interesting. Green Cards are a temporary thing, but, whilst he was Chancellor, he was awarded permanent status. This means he can both stay indefiniotely without a green card, and also means he has to pay US tax on all his income from anywhere in the world. I wonder if this is the first time a UK Prime Minister has paid US tax?
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I doubt it. Churchill’s mum was American.
 
If you are working class and manage to get into parliament , it would appear, according to the Labour leader (KS) that you cannot be attacked for any reason. So it looks as though we are about top have a two level parliament if KS has his way, the higher level for those who have been well educated and a lower level for the working class. Unbelievable.

I also cannot understand if she has nothing to hide, why she (AR) will not publish the legal advice she says proves she has done nothing wrong, and why Keir Starmer has also apparently not seen it. The whole thing stinks.
 
Curryman said:
I also cannot understand if she has nothing to hide, why she (AR) will not publish the legal advice she says proves she has done nothing wrong, and why Keir Starmer has also apparently not seen it. The whole thing stinks.
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My guess is that the "advice" is based on a set of facts that can easily be disproven, and thus would only make matters worse, alternatively, while it may clear her in one respect, it might point us towards another wrongdoing that she doesn't want to reveal.

What I don't get is if it's just the CGT, why she doesn't just pay the tax, issue a statement apologizing for the mistake, and move on, the fact she hasn't done this suggests to me that there's something much more serious she is trying to hide.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
And there in lies the reason for the country's crumbling infrastructure.
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Indeed, the biggest lie ever sold to the masses was that a low tax economy is in their interests when it clearly isn't. The whole thing with this stupid debate is that we don't even know is she's done anything wrong.
 
bill40 said:
Indeed, the biggest lie ever sold to the masses was that a low tax economy is in their interests when it clearly isn't. The whole thing with this stupid debate is that we don't even know is she's done anything wrong.
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Switzerland seems to be doing quite well with it.
 
bill40 said:
Indeed, the biggest lie ever sold to the masses was that a low tax economy is in their interests when it clearly isn't. The whole thing with this stupid debate is that we don't even know is she's done anything wrong.
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As the saying goes, Britain wanted European style public services but on an American style low tax system, and eventually how that ends is we've ended up with American public services on a European higher tax system
 
bill40 said:
In CH the maximum tax rate varies from 11pc to 36pc but heres the kicker, they also have a wealth tax by canton which makes the pips squeak. They also have excellent social care. Low tax it ain't.
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Only 27.2% of Swiss GDP is taken by tax, of which only 1% is from wealth taxes, and there appears to be plenty of ways around it, so very few people actually end up paying it.
 
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