surprised this hasn't been highlighted

hertfordseasider said:
Alkali attack in London

And this is one of the reasons why Brexit happened. Bleeding heart Liberals cannot defend this, surely? How the fuck did this creature get asylum?? Because on his third application he told them he had turned to Christianity. It's a complete joke.
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Not the time really. If you really want to play politics then he was granted asylum by which government?
 
Apart from the Brexit reference, I can’t see anything political, the attack was horrific, but it now transpires that this guy was convicted of a sexual offence in 2018, and yet was granted asylum on appeal. The home office turned him down, but a judge overturned the decision.

I agree with herts, he should not be here, if the Home office decision had stood, these poor people wouldn’t have what are being described as life changing injuries.
 
spudgun said:
Using an appalling act of violence like this to make puerile political statements about "Brexit" and "bleeding heart liberals" is frankly contemptible.
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I’m a 100% remainer, I think you’ve missed my point completely. It is an appalling act of violence and it shows up our system for what it is, not fit for purpose and it is things like this that makes you see why people voted to leave the EU, it also shows that nothing has changed. Home office say he has to go, but a judge overturns that decision.

It’s more than just politics as I have no doubt the same would have happened whoever was in power. It’s a system that is inundated with people who think they have the moral high ground but are just naive. I’m not sure turning it into “who was in power” comment (come on Wiz, you do it at every single opportunity) is relevant and I’m not voting conservative in the next election.

It’s a shocking incident but it should never ever have happened.
 
hertfordseasider said:
Alkali attack in London

And this is one of the reasons why Brexit happened. Bleeding heart Liberals cannot defend this, surely? How the fuck did this creature get asylum?? Because on his third application he told them he had turned to Christianity. It's a complete joke.
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What has this got to do with Brexit or bleeding heart liberals?

The person in question came from Afghanistan which is not in the EU. Brexit has not stopped people from Afghanistan seeking asylum in the UK, in fact boat crossings have increased since. The UK legal system dealt with his claim and granted asylum. What is the link to Brexit and bleeding heart liberals, I really don't understand?

In other news, yesterday the UK government announced that they will be reviewing all refused cases of ex-soldiers from Afghanistan who helped UK forces in the conflict there. Some of these people have since been killed by the Taliban, those that have survived will be granted asylum by the sounds of it, which is the correct decision IMO.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
What has this got to do with Brexit or bleeding heart liberals?

The person in question came from Afghanistan which is not in the EU. Brexit has not stopped people from Afghanistan seeking asylum in the UK, in fact boat crossings have increased since. The UK legal system dealt with his claim and granted asylum. What is the link to Brexit and bleeding heart liberals, I really don't understand?

In other news, yesterday the UK government announced that they will be reviewing all refused cases of ex-soldiers from Afghanistan who helped UK forces in the conflict there. Some of these people have since been killed by the Taliban, those that have survived will be granted asylum by the sounds of it, which is the correct decision IMO.
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Exactly, because people didn’t and still don’t have a clue how immigration works and why I mentioned Brexit, maybe I worded it badly, but people were and are ignorant as to what Brexit it was really about, people wanted Brexit to “protect our shores” it was a con by Boris, Farage and the like at the end of the day this person should have been deported when he was convicted of sexual offences, the bleeding heart liberal comment was aimed at those who were supporting him to stay, that’s not political that’s incredibly naive and stupid.
 
hertfordseasider said:
Exactly, because people didn’t and still don’t have a clue how immigration works and why I mentioned Brexit, maybe I worded it badly, but people were and are ignorant as to what Brexit it was really about, people wanted Brexit to “protect our shores” it was a con by Boris, Farage and the like at the end of the day this person should have been deported when he was convicted of sexual offences, the bleeding heart liberal comment was aimed at those who were supporting him to stay, that’s not political that’s incredibly naive and stupid.
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I was listening to this being discussed on the radio this morning.
If the Home Office / judge believes that the conversion to Christianity is genuine, then being deported back to Afghanistan could / would result in the death of the person involved. Stopping these sorts of state murders is what the asylum system is for. However, like everyone else I don't want sex offenders being granted asylum in the UK.
 
hertfordseasider said:
I’m a 100% remainer, I think you’ve missed my point completely. It is an appalling act of violence and it shows up our system for what it is, not fit for purpose and it is things like this that makes you see why people voted to leave the EU, it also shows that nothing has changed. Home office say he has to go, but a judge overturns that decision.

It’s more than just politics as I have no doubt the same would have happened whoever was in power. It’s a system that is inundated with people who think they have the moral high ground but are just naive. I’m not sure turning it into “who was in power” comment (come on Wiz, you do it at every single opportunity) is relevant and I’m not voting conservative in the next election.

It’s a shocking incident but it should never ever have happened.
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If it wasn't a political post, I'm not sure what it was supposed to be. It's an appalling case, but using it to generalise about immigration policy is poor form, really. As EBSN points out, there are many deserving cases out there.

If you'd contented yourself with saying that the quality of decision making needs improvement I doubt anyone would have disagreed with you. But if you then go on to add the ill-considered rubbish you started the OP with you shouldn't be surprised if you get challenged.
 
I can’t work out now if it is media sensationalism or if there genuinely is a massive imbalance between the number of major / horrific incidents occurring committed by those who have migrated here in the past ten years?

We know the government love to pin everything on those ‘boat / truck migrants’ as it suits their agenda, and certainly the RW press loves the stories - yet it seems as a % of these terrible crimes committed an unusual % are recent arrivals to this country?

If that’s the case, then once again what are we doing to assess and support these arrivals? The murderer in Nottingham should never have been on the streets as he was dangerously ill. This guy today was ‘known to the police’ (how often do we hear that?). Our budget priorities seem out of kilter completely.
 
Chunkylad said:
I can’t work out now if it is media sensationalism or if there genuinely is a massive imbalance between the number of major / horrific incidents occurring committed by those who have migrated here in the past ten years?

We know the government love to pin everything on those ‘boat / truck migrants’ as it suits their agenda, and certainly the RW press loves the stories - yet it seems as a % of these terrible crimes committed an unusual % are recent arrivals to this country?

If that’s the case, then once again what are we doing to assess and support these arrivals? The murderer in Nottingham should never have been on the streets as he was dangerously ill. This guy today was ‘known to the police’ (how often do we hear that?). Our budget priorities seem out of kilter completely.
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Interesting that the focus in this case is on immigration policy and not on prevention of violence against women.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
I was listening to this being discussed on the radio this morning.
If the Home Office / judge believes that the conversion to Christianity is genuine, then being deported back to Afghanistan could / would result in the death of the person involved. Stopping these sorts of state murders is what the asylum system is for. However, like everyone else I don't want sex offenders being granted asylum in the UK.
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You also have to doubt the validity of this sudden, convenient conversion, people can be devious you know.
 
In my book he has broken his asylum grant, his promise to be a good citizen of this country, and once found should be dealt with quickly and then deported back top his homeland. No excuses, he didn't know what he was doing, no pleas of it won't be safe he has proven beyond doubt that he is a risk to all those , particularly women,in this country.

As for politics, this is no time for it, he is a danger, full stop, and should be removed from this country at the earliest time available
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Interesting that the focus in this case is on immigration policy and not on prevention of violence against women.
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That’s another important matter too and one that hopefully we all agree on. I could talk for hours about that topic having been involved in the MAPPA process for several years in my professional standing and many of the subjects on that were horrifically high risk and dangerous to their partners and that’s just the tip of the iceberg, as I said, I could go on and on but it would take hours.
 
hertfordseasider said:
You also have to doubt the validity of this sudden, convenient conversion, people can be devious you know.
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Yes of course. But none of us are party to all of the facts in this case, I did work in this area many years ago. In those days the system was like this;

The appeal is a semi judicial procedure, it's like a court case where the facts are presented. People give evidence on oath. The HO wants to deport invariably and puts a case and there is usually somebody representing the appellant (often from a charity) that will put their case. The judge (not actually a judge but an adjudicator) decides whether the asylum rules have been applied properly, it's not a personal judgement, it's just checking that correct procedures have been followed and the law applied correctly. This appeal process is probably designed to protect the UK government from future claims against them when the rules have not been applied properly.

I'm not sure if this is still the case, but I'd guess it would be something like the above.
 
Twitter is awash with scathing "bleeding heart liberal" type posts from Tories who seem to have miraculously forgotten who the government is that have allowed this vile creature to stay in this country.
 
Chunkylad said:
I can’t work out now if it is media sensationalism or if there genuinely is a massive imbalance between the number of major / horrific incidents occurring committed by those who have migrated here in the past ten years?

We know the government love to pin everything on those ‘boat / truck migrants’ as it suits their agenda, and certainly the RW press loves the stories - yet it seems as a % of these terrible crimes committed an unusual % are recent arrivals to this country?

If that’s the case, then once again what are we doing to assess and support these arrivals? The murderer in Nottingham should never have been on the streets as he was dangerously ill. This guy today was ‘known to the police’ (how often do we hear that?). Our budget priorities seem out of kilter completely.
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Large numbers of people from completely alien cultures, often forced into communities that don't want them, what could possibly go wrong?
 
In a wider context, Brexit is a factor and it is changing the demographic of this country. Because of Brexit, we have lost a lot of "Christian" believing part of our society either by people leaving to return to their homeland or people not actually coming to the UK. And because of our immigration policy, we are bringing in more "Muslim" believing people.

Of course, its up to you if you are happy with the changing face of the UK . I'm just making the general point that Brexit and Immigration into the UK is changing this country
 
Macseasider said:
Twitter is awash with scathing "bleeding heart liberal" type posts from Tories who seem to have miraculously forgotten who the government is that have allowed this vile creature to stay in this country.
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As I said in my post, 'As for politics, this is no time for it, he is a danger, full stop, and should be removed from this country at the earliest time available', but it's obvious that politics for some transcend all other subjects.

Oh and please do not quote the oft used phrase that everything is political.

That's me done and I'm off out.
 
Hertsseasider said:
In a wider context, Brexit is a factor and it is changing the demographic of this country. Because of Brexit, we have lost a lot of "Christian" believing part of our society either by people leaving to return to their homeland or people not actually coming to the UK. And because of our immigration policy, we are bringing in more "Muslim" believing people.

Of course, its up to you if you are happy with the changing face of the UK . I'm just making the general point that Brexit and Immigration into the UK is changing this country
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I'm glad you're here Herts!! Can yo PM me the POC for tomorrow please? 👍
 
hertfordseasider said:
I’m a 100% remainer, I think you’ve missed my point completely. It is an appalling act of violence and it shows up our system for what it is, not fit for purpose and it is things like this that makes you see why people voted to leave the EU, it also shows that nothing has changed. Home office say he has to go, but a judge overturns that decision.

It’s more than just politics as I have no doubt the same would have happened whoever was in power. It’s a system that is inundated with people who think they have the moral high ground but are just naive. I’m not sure turning it into “who was in power” comment (come on Wiz, you do it at every single opportunity) is relevant and I’m not voting conservative in the next election.

It’s a shocking incident but it should never ever have happened.
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I think the issue is if that's why people voted for Brexit, then they were misinformed, because as you say the asylum system is still broken and he was from Afghanistan. You've actually made a very strong remain argument in a very backhanded way. Many remainers at the time pointed out to brexiteers that greviences like this won't be fixed by Brexit and were dismissed as bleeding heart liberals.
 
BWseasider said:
I think the issue is if that's why people voted for Brexit, then they were misinformed, because as you say the asylum system is still broken and he was from Afghanistan. You've actually made a very strong remain argument in a very backhanded way. Many remainers at the time pointed out to brexiteers that greviences like this won't be fixed by Brexit and were dismissed as bleeding heart liberals.
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That is exactly what I was trying to say, I don't think I worded my OP very well.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
If the Home Office / judge believes that the conversion to Christianity is genuine, then being deported back to Afghanistan could / would result in the death of the person involved. Stopping these sorts of state murders is what the asylum system is for. However, like everyone else I don't want sex offenders being granted asylum in the UK.
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Maybe we could send him to a country with a majority Christian populace, such as Rwanda 😜 👿
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
I was listening to this being discussed on the radio this morning.
If the Home Office / judge believes that the conversion to Christianity is genuine, then being deported back to Afghanistan could / would result in the death of the person involved. Stopping these sorts of state murders is what the asylum system is for. However, like everyone else I don't want sex offenders being granted asylum in the UK.
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Readymade loophole right there.

Step right up to take advantage
 
Brexit or no brexit the boats would still be on the way why do people who hate our way of life risk there lives to get here.i would never think of emigrating to pakistan Afghanistan or any other stan maybe Canada or Australia or poulton our courts seem to b run by fools scared of the r word can’t see a solution only more problems. Sorry about my grammar went to st toms
 
Tangerine sausage said:
Brexit or no brexit the boats would still be on the way why do people who hate our way of life risk there lives to get here.i would never think of emigrating to pakistan Afghanistan or any other stan maybe Canada or Australia or poulton our courts seem to b run by fools scared of the r word can’t see a solution only more problems. Sorry about my grammar went to st toms
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Some generalisation there. Not everyone who comes here hates our way of life, far from it.
 
Tangerine sausage said:
Brexit or no brexit the boats would still be on the way why do people who hate our way of life risk there lives to get here.i would never think of emigrating to pakistan Afghanistan or any other stan maybe Canada or Australia or poulton our courts seem to b run by fools scared of the r word can’t see a solution only more problems. Sorry about my grammar went to st toms
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Poulton!! Love it! 😂😂😂
 
The whole case is just horrible and I hope its not too bad, there's something very unsettling about chemical attacks like this.
 
straightatthewall said:
I think it's pretty reasonable to question why someone has been granted asylum when they have been convicted of a serious offense after arriving in the country. It doesn't mean you're racist and it also doesn't mean other people arriving and looking to live in the country shouldn't be allowed to.
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The answer to that is that the courts were persuaded that his conversion to Christianity made him vulnerable to persecution in Afghanistan, and thus he did qualify for asylum.

The wider question is why the courts didn't treat the obvious sham as the obvious sham it so clearly was.
 
Makes you wonder how many other la have “converted” to Christianity as a method of getting asylum. Let’s face it, not many who were born and live here practice religion.
 
Matesrates said:
Apart from the Brexit reference, I can’t see anything political, the attack was horrific, but it now transpires that this guy was convicted of a sexual offence in 2018, and yet was granted asylum on appeal. The home office turned him down, but a judge overturned the decision.

I agree with herts, he should not be here, if the Home office decision had stood, these poor people wouldn’t have what are being described as life changing injuries.
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Beggars belief
 
hertfordseasider said:
Alkali attack in London

And this is one of the reasons why Brexit happened. Bleeding heart Liberals cannot defend this, surely? How the fuck did this creature get asylum?? Because on his third application he told them he had turned to Christianity. It's a complete joke.
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This is exactly the sort of extreme example people have been concerned about and yes it is extreme but is a very real risk of letting people in who we know little about, especially after they arrive illegally. Some arriving clearly dont share our values and clearly don't have have any sort of morals.

It actually does genuine asylum seekers no favours either, as it paints a bad picture that people remember, rightly or wrongly.

It can only take 1 or a few who hate the country or with murderous intent to cause absolute chaos.

It really is time to get tough as we're such a soft country these days and allow people to completely play the system, aided by lefty lawyers and activists.

If we don't get a grip expect more of this, as when you have little to no idea who you're letting in, this is a very real possibility, as sadly proven.
 
Meanwhile, what the police are spending their time on: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...-banned-gender-critical-posts-permier-league/

A female football fan was banned from matches over social media posts that were deemed transphobic after a “Stasi” spying investigation by the Premier League.

A special unit set up to root out racism in the game was used to comb through comments made by Linzi Smith, a gender-critical Newcastle United supporter, even though the posts had nothing to do with football.

Ms Smith, who is gay and promotes lesbian, gay and bisexual rights and women’s rights, was put under investigation by the police, the Premier League and Newcastle United after expressing strong views on trans ideology on her personal account on X, formerly Twitter.

She was interviewed under caution by police after the dossier was handed to officers by Newcastle United. Officers took just two hours to inform her that she had not committed any crime, but the club, which had spent four months looking into her background, revoked her membership and banned her from games until 2026.
 
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