Player investment

Z

zico_bamber

Well-known member
Obviously there’s been a lot of incoming revenue. During the Oyston tenure, we had various large money departures and a lack of reinvestment. What happened to the <insert players name> money etc.

Do we trust that a bunch of planning applications are an acceptable justification for downscaling the team and squad to one that is a shell of its former self?

“Where’s the money gone”. Remember the chant? When sections used to hold the board to accountability. The last striker we got in of any note was Ellis Simms, albeit on loan. I think the fans have gone soft. Whilst the managerial issues aren’t great, the real problem as I see it is investment and trying to make do with what we have (which isn’t good enough).
 
Was thinking about this before.

I remember moaning last year that we’d criminally left ourselves with Gary Madine as the only physical striker option and he was dead on his feet most games…

We’re got unlucky with Joseph, but we’ve not got Lavery out and got Rhodes in (on loan) but relying on Jake Beesley who is nowhere near good enough.

I can’t believe we’ve always had Rhodes in mind and think it’s a stop gap till Joseph returns but we’ve lost Yates and Madine and spent £0 on a crucial part of the pitch we’ve needed for 2 seasons.

The way we’ve not signed wide or creative players is also bizarre. Lower bids again for players that won’t get accepted. Like Barlaser and Bashiri with Moxon…

There’s a week to sort it but we need to exert some authority at our level.

Was it not the model promised that transfer fees would be reinvested?

Even if we spent 1-1.5 million of the 2.5m we got for Yates I’d be more than happy.

Personally, I think we have the money to spend, but there’s a caveat on how much. If they value a player they’ll pay it, if they think it’s above their own set value they won’t. Unfortunately, business doesn’t work like that when clubs know you have money.
 
People bemoan how much we’re not spending surely have to factor in the apparent 6,000,000 drop in revenue from last season, sure we would have also had to pay apples off too?
In my book that accounts for the Yates cash, the compo from Critchley and the bowler cash. Not going to say Saddler is the perfect owner and he’s not made any mistakes but we need to factor in both sides of the argument before going hell for leather against him
 
Hankey2009 said:
People bemoan how much we’re not spending surely have to factor in the apparent 6,000,000 drop in revenue from last season, sure we would have also had to pay apples off too?
In my book that accounts for the Yates cash, the compo from Critchley and the bowler cash. Not going to say Saddler is the perfect owner and he’s not made any mistakes but we need to factor in both sides of the argument before going hell for leather against him
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One thing I think people forget is that the £6m(7?) was also used to fund quality loans. We will have paid loan feed for Patino, Fiorini and Poveda especially and you would think we paid decent money towards wages too. Further factor in Madine and Yates were high earners- Madine close to 10kpw, Yates, not sure, but given he signed an additional contract you'd think 6/7k. Those 2 alone account for 1mill, add in the other fees and wages, Keshi's wage, Stewarts, Bridcutts etc and you're going to be up there.

That's without the income from deals.

The point is the £6m is no longer required to cover those expenditures, so I doubt we have a shortfall.
 
How much is known about the Blackpool FC financial situation, I find business and accounting stuff really dull but how much information is out there?
My thoughts would be that the more open and honest the club are with the fan base then it makes for greater unity but I know nothing about the world of business.
 
fcblackpool said:
One thing I think people forget is that the £6m(7?) was also used to fund quality loans. We will have paid loan feed for Patino, Fiorini and Poveda especially and you would think we paid decent money towards wages too. Further factor in Madine and Yates were high earners- Madine close to 10kpw, Yates, not sure, but given he signed an additional contract you'd think 6/7k. Those 2 alone account for 1mill, add in the other fees and wages, Keshi's wage, Stewarts, Bridcutts etc and you're going to be up there.

That's without the income from deals.

The point is the £6m is no longer required to cover those expenditures, so I doubt we have a shortfall.
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Shouldn't wages be budgeted for Surely? Player sales are bonus.
I dont know how much we we paid in loan fees for the players mentioned but I bet we could have bought a couple of decent players for the same amount.
 
Hankey2009 said:
People bemoan how much we’re not spending surely have to factor in the apparent 6,000,000 drop in revenue from last season, sure we would have also had to pay apples off too?
In my book that accounts for the Yates cash, the compo from Critchley and the bowler cash. Not going to say Saddler is the perfect owner and he’s not made any mistakes but we need to factor in both sides of the argument before going hell for leather against him
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It was partly Sadlers fault, again through lack of investment last season that we went down.
 
Albert Ross said:
It was partly Sadlers fault, again through lack of investment last season that we went down.
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I dont think it was lack of investment really, it was mostly lack of skill in finding the right coach. But we also have to face up to the fact that we are a small club in the Championship. With a small budget. We have to over perform to stay in there, and we didnt.
 
voyeur said:
I dont think it was lack of investment really, it was mostly lack of skill in finding the right coach. But we also have to face up to the fact that we are a small club in the Championship. With a small budget. We have to over perform to stay in there, and we didnt.
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The recruitment last season was poor, it was essentially dead money as all the loan players were going to leave and we'd have no assets to show for it. This coupled with a poor managerial appointment was always going to hamper us this season with the drop in revenue from being in the division below.
We never seem to struggle to sign players, but are they really of the quality we need to get back out of this division, or just young-ish players we're taking a punt on? For every Bowler or Yates there's been a hell of a lot more crap that we've had to get rid of to trim the wage bill.
 
gjr said:
How much is known about the Blackpool FC financial situation, I find business and accounting stuff really dull but how much information is out there?
My thoughts would be that the more open and honest the club are with the fan base then it makes for greater unity but I know nothing about the world of business.
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Accounts are published annually and free to view on Companies House website.
 
BlackpoolsFinest said:
The recruitment last season was poor, it was essentially dead money as all the loan players were going to leave and we'd have no assets to show for it. This coupled with a poor managerial appointment was always going to hamper us this season with the drop in revenue from being in the division below.
We never seem to struggle to sign players, but are they really of the quality we need to get back out of this division, or just young-ish players we're taking a punt on? For every Bowler or Yates there's been a hell of a lot more crap that we've had to get rid of to trim the wage bill.
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Too many loans yes, but we had enough quality to stay up. Completely wasted ghe talents of Rogers Bowler Poveda Fiorini Patino. Thats half og a good Championship team. We really just lacked some steel in midfield.
 
voyeur said:
I dont think it was lack of investment really, it was mostly lack of skill in finding the right coach. But we also have to face up to the fact that we are a small club in the Championship. With a small budget. We have to over perform to stay in there, and we didnt.
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We have needed a creative midfielder for 2/3 seasons. Supposedly offered £1 million + for, whispers. Brannagan for a couple of windows so the money was there, just not spent wisely. We apparently have a top 6 budget in this league, but are still being left behind in quality. Something isn’t right somewhere.
 
voyeur said:
Too many loans yes, but we had enough quality to stay up. Completely wasted ghe talents of Rogers Bowler Poveda Fiorini Patino. Thats half og a good Championship team. We really just lacked some steel in midfield.
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That's where the poor management comes in.
And whilst I was never a fan of Appleton and thought he was a poor choice from day one, I never called for his head after 4 games like some are doing now for Critchley.
 
seasideone said:
Accounts are published annually and free to view on Companies House website.
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So I guess that means we know all the financial comings and goings such as what happened to the Bowler, Critchley and Yates money, or do we? because the friends i have that are self employed tell me they get quite imaginative with their accountants!
Obviously they operate on a much smaller scale than BFC but if the club has to publish everything why do so many people assume that the club is not reinvesting properly?
 
fcblackpool said:
One thing I think people forget is that the £6m(7?) was also used to fund quality loans. We will have paid loan feed for Patino, Fiorini and Poveda especially and you would think we paid decent money towards wages too. Further factor in Madine and Yates were high earners- Madine close to 10kpw, Yates, not sure, but given he signed an additional contract you'd think 6/7k. Those 2 alone account for 1mill, add in the other fees and wages, Keshi's wage, Stewarts, Bridcutts etc and you're going to be up there.

That's without the income from deals.

The point is the £6m is no longer required to cover those expenditures, so I doubt we have a shortfall.
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‘Quality loans’ that were ultimately wasted by the lack of investment in other key areas.

A team with Bowler, Rogers, Poveda, Patino, Fiorini should never have gone down but it did due to an inability to bring in quality players on a permanent basis.
 
gjr said:
So I guess that means we know all the financial comings and goings such as what happened to the Bowler, Critchley and Yates money, or do we? because the friends i have that are self employed tell me they get quite imaginative with their accountants!
Obviously they operate on a much smaller scale than BFC but if the club has to publish everything why do so many people assume that the club is not reinvesting properly?
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Depending on the size of turnover depends on what detail you have to give.

The last edition published will probably be about 18 months old I would guess.
 
seasideone said:
Depending on the size of turnover depends on what detail you have to give.

The last edition published will probably be about 18 months old I would guess.
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So eventually some of the information is out there, bigger the organisation less detail needs to be given I'm guessing or is it the other way around?
 
People asking where x money for x player went. Running a football club isn't free, the money has to still come from somewhere and I'm sure that the club (especially being a league lower) is not generating significant enough revenue to mean that there isn't a good chunk coming out of Sadler's pockets.

Those people are also again, failing to take into account the long-term vision of the club and building new training ground, the project around the stadium etc etc are very costly. We've also seen the current training ground getting upgrades in the meantime.

We've no idea what money was invested to bring in Norburn and Joseph, or what we're paying for Rhodes to be here, or as someone pointed out what we paid for all the loans we had last season.

We aren't going to break the club's transfer record to bring in Clarke Harris, nor would it make any sense to do so as the cost would be most of the Yates sale money and at that point, why bother selling Yates at all?
 
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If we're to pay or offer anything like a million for a player we'd never get the deal over the line because anyone worth that much will I imagine be above our wage limit. Brannagan was never gonna come here for what we were offering and this bullshit failed medical of Bishop was more I suspect about wages.
 
gjr said:
How much is known about the Blackpool FC financial situation, I find business and accounting stuff really dull but how much information is out there?
My thoughts would be that the more open and honest the club are with the fan base then it makes for greater unity but I know nothing about the world of business.
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We're operating at a slight (in football terms) loss at last review.

It's important to understand that 'a slight loss' for a championship club is equivalent to '** unreal profits' in any other business.

My view is that we need another shot of investment otherwise the value of the assets we have might not mature - i.e. we've got some players who are potentially decent, but if we don't add a bit more quality, they won't reach their potential as it's a team game and you're, to some extent, as good as your weakest team mate.

It's also very different splashing a bit of cash to compete in this league than the one above.

We're actually a reasonably competitive proposition in this division. We need to act like that.
 
Take Carey as an example. He could be worth millions or nothing.

He's a player who needs other to make the space and time to do what he does.

Those others might cost a bit but his potential value will outweigh that.

For Carey, see Lavs, Apter, Morgan or whoever you rate.

Point is, you've got to have a coherent team to build individuals.

You can't, to use @Shiggy 's term 'half arse' it and we're definitely not coherent yet.

The business model requires investment now in my opinion.
 
Critchley has said there's money available, but who knows how much that is. Winter said we have a top 8 budget in this league, so let's act like it. You've got Charlton ready to spend £750k on a striker, maybe pushing to £1m for Nombe and we're messing about putting bids in for less than half of what the players worth. If we aren't gonna pay, fair enough, but putting silly bids in is embarrassing.
 
td53 said:
Take Carey as an example. He could be worth millions or nothing.

He's a player who needs other to make the space and time to do what he does.

Those others might cost a bit but his potential value will outweigh that.

For Carey, see Lavs, Apter, Morgan or whoever you rate.

Point is, you've got to have a coherent team to build individuals.

You can't, to use @Shiggy 's term 'half arse' it and we're definitely not coherent yet.

The business model requires investment now in my opinion.
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On a simple level, striker in a buoyant attacking tram scores regularly and offers come in from other clubs. Goal.scorers attract money but depend on team mates and confidence and system.
 
Albert Ross said:
It was partly Sadlers fault, again through lack of investment last season that we went down.
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Nah . The coaching staff weren’t up to it.

Mickysauras and Terrydactyl couldn’t have got a tune out of Erling Haaland . The players more or less have said it . They didn’t know what they were supposed to do most of the time.

Dobbie showed us that the players could have kept us up if coached properly and by playing the right system .

Turning Bloomfield Road into Jurassic Park sent us down .
 
AngelBFC said:
Nah . The coaching staff weren’t up to it.

Mickysauras and Terrydactyl couldn’t have got a tune out of Erling Haaland . The players more or less have said it . They didn’t know what they were supposed to do most of the time.

Dobbie showed us that the players could have done it coached properly and playing the right system .

Turning Bloomfield Road into Jurassic Park sent us down .
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That was 80% of the problem, but Appleton, although I was bitterly disappointed when he was appointed, wasn’t given the backing in the summer window. That’s one of the reasons we ended up with Bridcutt, I know Appleton wanted him, but we were left with little choice once the window had slammed shut.
 
it seems like forward planning on players stopped between Summer 21 and Jan 22 transfer windows. As others have said, we have been spending (all the loan players last season won’t be cheap) but here we are with painfully obviously lack of options in attack. Going to take at least 1 year to sort out and per above, in that time, the likes of Carey, Morgan, Dale etc are likely to stagnate i think. Hope it’s faster but trying to be realistic
 
Adams Kebab said:
Was thinking about this before.

I remember moaning last year that we’d criminally left ourselves with Gary Madine as the only physical striker option and he was dead on his feet most games…

We’re got unlucky with Joseph, but we’ve not got Lavery out and got Rhodes in (on loan) but relying on Jake Beesley who is nowhere near good enough.

I can’t believe we’ve always had Rhodes in mind and think it’s a stop gap till Joseph returns but we’ve lost Yates and Madine and spent £0 on a crucial part of the pitch we’ve needed for 2 seasons.

The way we’ve not signed wide or creative players is also bizarre. Lower bids again for players that won’t get accepted. Like Barlaser and Bashiri with Moxon…

There’s a week to sort it but we need to exert some authority at our level.

Was it not the model promised that transfer fees would be reinvested?

Even if we spent 1-1.5 million of the 2.5m we got for Yates I’d be more than happy.

Personally, I think we have the money to spend, but there’s a caveat on how much. If they value a player they’ll pay it, if they think it’s above their own set value they won’t. Unfortunately, business doesn’t work like that when clubs know you have money
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Lavery and Beesley may get you 20 between them but neither IMHO are good enough for this league.. certainly for a club looking to bounce back. When the likes of Tony Ellis, Paul Dickov, DJ, Ellis Simms and maybe Jerry to a certain degree arrived, you knew something good would happen. I agree about Joseph.

Not enough investment in a key position.
 
voyeur said:
I dont think it was lack of investment really, it was mostly lack of skill in finding the right coach. But we also have to face up to the fact that we are a small club in the Championship. With a small budget. We have to over perform to stay in there, and we didnt.
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Gimme a break. No doubt there is a monetary division within a division but stop with the little Blackpool talk. The Oystons for goodness sake proved what can be done. We are where we are because of avoidable stupidity and we’ll stay where we are unless lessons were learned.
 
Sadlers not going for it, something has definitely changed.

You can’t blame him for not tanning millions a year on football, I get the feeling he’s fed up with it all.

What I would blame him for is his managerial appointments. Probably the worst decisions ever with absolutely no awareness of fans opinions, staggering.
 
gjr said:
So eventually some of the information is out there, bigger the organisation less detail needs to be given I'm guessing or is it the other way around?
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There is a set turnover (I cannot remember the amount) where you go from small accounts to reporting much more.

Listed companies have to give much more on top of that as well.
 
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Albert Ross said:
That was 80% of the problem, but Appleton, although I was bitterly disappointed when he was appointed, wasn’t given the backing in the summer window. That’s one of the reasons we ended up with Bridcutt, I know Appleton wanted him, but we were left with little choice once the window had slammed shut.
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How much of that was players just not wanting to play for the most uninspiring manager ever?
 
I'm left wondering what these back room recruitment guys are doing to earn their salaries, to be honest. If Kylian Kouassi is the sum total of their summer's work, then something is amiss in my opinion.
 
I mean, lets be honest, it can't be easy. "Yeah, come on down to Blackpool where we'll play you as an inverted goalkeeper (you don't keep goal, the goal keeps you) and you get to train in a porta-cabin with a stairmaster and a vending machine that only has curly wurleys in it".

Yes, everything has been incredibly underwhelming over the last year but we're a work in progress. I watched a video showing Jerry's first day at Swansea with them showing him around the facilities and it brought home the difficult game of catch up we're playing here, I'd love Sadler to go mental and start spraying money about but he's just not that kinda guy and even if he was, we are not in the strongest bargaining position. The fact that we've managed to get Norburn from under Bolton's nose and Rhodes chose us over Derby shows they must be offering decent wages, lets face it, there isn't much else to come to us for at this moment in time.
 
fcblackpool said:
One thing I think people forget is that the £6m(7?) was also used to fund quality loans. We will have paid loan feed for Patino, Fiorini and Poveda especially and you would think we paid decent money towards wages too. Further factor in Madine and Yates were high earners- Madine close to 10kpw, Yates, not sure, but given he signed an additional contract you'd think 6/7k. Those 2 alone account for 1mill, add in the other fees and wages, Keshi's wage, Stewarts, Bridcutts etc and you're going to be up there.

That's without the income from deals.

The point is the £6m is no longer required to cover those expenditures, so I doubt we have a shortfall.
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I think your maths is bonkers
 
poolseasider said:
We have already despite it being part of the Yates deal get your backside out. 😂
Our previous owners would have just pocketed the cash and not took less to get a new young prospect in.👍
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Joseph cost £1m? I thought he was worth £750k, that's what was reported by the Swansea reporter. I get that the scum would have just wanted cash, just think that anyone on here thinking we are going to spend £1m cash on a player is delusional, it won't happen until we're back in the Championship. The loss of revenue from last season to this took care of that.
 
Kyle Seasider said:
Joseph cost £1m? I thought he was worth £750k, that's what was reported by the Swansea reporter. I get that the scum would have just wanted cash, just think that anyone on here thinking we are going to spend £1m cash on a player is delusional, it won't happen until we're back in the Championship. The loss of revenue from last season to this took care of that.
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Wasn't that the figure 750k that Swansea turned down?
 
poolseasider said:
Wasn't that the figure 750k that Swansea turned down?
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According the the Swansea jurno they wanted £750k for him, but the offer they got fell short. We knocked £750k off the asking price for Yates in the deal. It was a local new paper that said it, so I don't know how reliable it is, but they bought him for £500k the year before and he's hardly don't anything to double his price since then.
 
Kyle Seasider said:
According the the Swansea jurno they wanted £750k for him, but the offer they got fell short. We knocked £750k off the asking price for Yates in the deal. It was a local new paper that said it, so I don't know how reliable it is, but they bought him for £500k the year before and he's hardly don't anything to double his price since then.
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You are completely wrong in what you say. Believing newspaper twaddle. When will you learn?
 
TANGERINETOWERPOWER said:
Last minute dot com again and all so avoidable…we simply had to invest in the playing staff last year and we didn’t…reap what you sow. We still need 3-4 quality players in as most have been saying from before the start of the season…I feel we have wasted a relatively easy start and we have given teams a head start
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I would wholeheartedly agree with that. We have lost the £6m revenue due to mistakes from above in poor management at all levels and lack off investment.
 
Charlie Gracie said:
You are completely wrong in what you say. Believing newspaper twaddle. When will you learn?
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And how do you know? Do you have an insider at the club that let's you know exactly what's happening and when it's happening? If not, then how are you so sure I'm wrong? At the end of the day, all any of us on here have to go off is reports, that's it. Unless you'd like to enlighten us all with your source.
 
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