And they keep on coming

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tommytwojags

tommytwojags

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How much longer is the UK going to let France laugh at us while pocketing £500m of our money for controlling the movement of asylum seekers across the channel? Despite Manny Macron's assurance that extra manpower, drones and equipment would be assigned to prevent the life-risking movement of men, women and children, most without life jackets, the police turn a blind eye and another boatload leaves for Blighty.

Traffickers openly make deals of £3000 per person and 100 more cram into the death trap dinghy. £300,000 per crossing allows the organisers to buy more boats and carry more desperate passengers to the land of milk and honey.

Meanwhile, a cruise ship arrives in Barcelona with 69 Bolivian illegal immigrants. What does Spain do? It orders MSC Cruises to fly them back to Bolivia. Human rights my a**e.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/ne...S&cvid=09699937aae34d8da0c716b3cc8dac46&ei=45
 
Shandypants said:
I can think of many, many more issues in this country to get worked up about.
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I think that’s a kop out answer if I’m being honest what other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions pounds at annually without any returns?

Illegal immigration is costing this country probably nearer a billion pounds annually once you throw in Rwanda and if truth be known it’s getting worse this money could and should be spent on other things like education/schools, the elderly, the homeless, the NHS, even the highways department fixing these bloody potholes.

Quite clearly as the O/P points out the French are clearly taking the piss here and we keep falling for it it’s time this country grew some balls and ordered the RNLI/Coast guard to take them straight back to France and not bring them by here.

As the O/P points out it’s only ever us that seems to have to abide with the human rights courts as clearly other countries do what they want regarding immigration and rightly so.

Soft Britain always has always will be.
 
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tommytwojags said:
How much longer is the UK going to let France laugh at us while pocketing £500m of our money for controlling the movement of asylum seekers across the channel? Despite Manny Macron's assurance that extra manpower, drones and equipment would be assigned to prevent the life-risking movement of men, women and children, most without life jackets, the police turn a blind eye and another boatload leaves for Blighty.

Traffickers openly make deals of £3000 per person and 100 more cram into the death trap dinghy. £300,000 per crossing allows the organisers to buy more boats and carry more desperate passengers to the land of milk and honey.

Meanwhile, a cruise ship arrives in Barcelona with 69 Bolivian illegal immigrants. What does Spain do? It orders MSC Cruises to fly them back to Bolivia. Human rights my a**e.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/ne...S&cvid=09699937aae34d8da0c716b3cc8dac46&ei=45
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Not quite sure who you're being angry at. If Macron's commitment has been put into practice why are the police turning a blind-eye? Also, whose police - those from the UK or the French force?
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
I think that’s a kop out answer if I’m being honest what other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions pounds at annually without any returns?

Illegal immigration is costing this country probably nearer a billion pounds annually once you throw in Rwanda and if truth be known it’s getting worse this money could and should be spent on other things like education/schools, the elderly, the homeless, the NHS, even the highways department fixing these bloody potholes.

Quite clearly as the O/P points out the French are clearly taking the piss here and we keep falling for it it’s time this country grew some balls and ordered the RNLI/Coast guard to take them straight back to France and not bring them by here.

As the O/P points out it’s only ever us that seems to have to abide with the human rights courts as clearly other countries do what they want regarding immigration and rightly so.

Soft Britain always has always will be.
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what other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions pounds at annually without any returns?

The NHS?
 
Old_Laytonian said:
what other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions pounds at annually without any returns?

The NHS?
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That’s a department that we simply have to fund as it’s a service we all have to use at some time in our lives and we think ourselves lucky we have such a service illegal immigration isn’t a service we should be throwing hundreds of millions of pounds at annually with no end product and especially when we have other priorities as I’ve already listed.

I thought someone like you would have sussed that straight away.
 
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Jaffa_The_Hut said:
I think that’s a kop out answer if I’m being honest what other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions pounds at annually without any returns?

Illegal immigration is costing this country probably nearer a billion pounds annually once you throw in Rwanda and if truth be known it’s getting worse this money could and should be spent on other things like education/schools, the elderly, the homeless, the NHS, even the highways department fixing these bloody potholes.

Quite clearly as the O/P points out the French are clearly taking the piss here and we keep falling for it it’s time this country grew some balls and ordered the RNLI/Coast guard to take them straight back to France and not bring them by here.

As the O/P points out it’s only ever us that seems to have to abide with the human rights courts as clearly other countries do what they want regarding immigration and rightly so.

Soft Britain always has always will be.
Click to expand...
What other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions at a year with no return?

The water companies for starters.

Any sign of getting £229 million back off Michelle Mone?

Far bigger problems to be solved.
 
1966_and_all_that said:
Not quite sure who you're being angry at. If Macron's commitment has been put into practice why are the police turning a blind-eye? Also, whose police - those from the UK or the French force?
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Angry? More embarrassed I would say. Embarrassed at how the UK invites contempt and ridicule from our gallic neighbours because of its lack of backbone.
 
tommytwojags said:
Angry? More embarrassed I would say. Embarrassed at how the UK invites contempt and ridicule from our gallic neighbours because of its lack of backbone.
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Sorry TTJ, I was just trying to understand where your focus was in your post: Macron, French police, UK police, UK policy, French Govt behaviour?
 
Wizaard said:
What other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions at a year with no return?

The water companies for starters.

Any sign of getting £229 million back off Michelle Mone?

Far bigger problems to be solved.
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Another poor example again you’ve used as we are all at the mercy of water companies like the NHS.

But in answering it Water companies are rightly being fined for their errors.

Thames water authority were fined £35.7m for water pollution between 2017-23.

United Utilities we’re fined £800,000 in August 2023 for illegally abstracting 22 billion litres of water from Lancashire bore holes.

The list is endless but I’m happy to carry on if you want?

Still not sure what bigger financial issues outweigh illegal immigration as what benefits do we get financially from it?

You (and rightly so ) have been very critical in the money the Government are throwing at trying to curb illegal immigration but come the next general election when Labour get in it will be interesting to hear your views then because this topic is suddenly not going to disappear overnight with Labour in power.
 
Like it or not if this hopeless government really wanted to stop illegal immigration they could do it tonight end of
 
tommytwojags said:
How much longer is the UK going to let France laugh at us while pocketing £500m of our money for controlling the movement of asylum seekers across the channel? Despite Manny Macron's assurance that extra manpower, drones and equipment would be assigned to prevent the life-risking movement of men, women and children, most without life jackets, the police turn a blind eye and another boatload leaves for Blighty.

Traffickers openly make deals of £3000 per person and 100 more cram into the death trap dinghy. £300,000 per crossing allows the organisers to buy more boats and carry more desperate passengers to the land of milk and honey.

Meanwhile, a cruise ship arrives in Barcelona with 69 Bolivian illegal immigrants. What does Spain do? It orders MSC Cruises to fly them back to Bolivia. Human rights my a**e.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/ne...S&cvid=09699937aae34d8da0c716b3cc8dac46&ei=45
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If only we hadn't voted to remove our voice and influence inside the EU.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Another poor example again you’ve used as we are all at the mercy of water companies like the NHS.
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The NHS is in public ownership (just). Water companies are in private ownership.

Specifically our for-profit water and sewage companies: they paid £1.4 billion in dividends in 2022 alone, and to date since privatisation it's a staggering £75 billion paid to shareholders (for extra laughs: there are years where water companies failed to make a profit; in these years they BORROWED more money (meatured in the billions) to maintain the dividend to shareholders!).

If we were not at the 'mercy' of the privatisation of our water and sewage, we could spend these staggering sums on education, health, our communities, and, yes, border control.

The water companies are currently in the public eye, but the same story is happening across all the privatised utilities, transport, and increasingly the parts of the NHS which are profitable to run privately.

Uncontrolled borders are a problem -- but a pretty small one when compared to the failed experiment of Thatcherism and the privatisation of our common assets. These huge problems (along with the other great failure of our state, 'austerity') must be acknowledged.

Illegal immigration is a useful distraction which has proved effective time and again. It's no surprise border control was pushed back into the news agenda after the Truss government economic implosion.

I've rambled here, but it's really a minor issue which gets outsized attention.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
I think that’s a kop out answer if I’m being honest what other issues are we throwing hundreds of millions pounds at annually without any returns?

Illegal immigration is costing this country probably nearer a billion pounds annually once you throw in Rwanda and if truth be known it’s getting worse this money could and should be spent on other things like education/schools, the elderly, the homeless, the NHS, even the highways department fixing these bloody potholes.

Quite clearly as the O/P points out the French are clearly taking the piss here and we keep falling for it it’s time this country grew some balls and ordered the RNLI/Coast guard to take them straight back to France and not bring them by here.

As the O/P points out it’s only ever us that seems to have to abide with the human rights courts as clearly other countries do what they want regarding immigration and rightly so.

Soft Britain always has always will be.
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Gosh, where to start?

Rawanda has cost £500 million to achieve precisely nothing because it's illegal. Reducing the number of officials dealing with asylum claims increased the waiting list and necessitated far more people having to be accommodated as they are not allowed to work. £1.5 billion to that Aussie travel company for the prison ship on the south cost, hundreds of millions to hotel companies.

France has offered a processing centre on French soil but the Government has refused it. That would chop the legs off the trafficers in one fell swoop, so why are they opposed?

Every other Mainland European country has taken far more refugees than the UK

We are desperately short of manual labour in many industries, yet don't let claimants work to support themselves and their families.

It's a distraction to take your eye off where your money is really going, cronyism, Infosys, SEZs
 
Tangerinemoss said:
Gosh, where to start?

France has offered a processing centre on French soil but the Government has refused it. That would chop the legs off the trafficers in one fell swoop, so why are they opposed?
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The UK sought agreement to patrol the Normandy coast and control illegal trafficking but France refused saying they would do it so long as the UK paid. It's not as though it's a difficult job. You stop them on the beach and seize their boats. If you look at the video in the OP you can see that the French police are openly encouraging the traffickers. Every single death in the Channel is the fault of France.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Another poor example again you’ve used as we are all at the mercy of water companies like the NHS.

But in answering it Water companies are rightly being fined for their errors.

Thames water authority were fined £35.7m for water pollution between 2017-23.

United Utilities we’re fined £800,000 in August 2023 for illegally abstracting 22 billion litres of water from Lancashire bore holes.

The list is endless but I’m happy to carry on if you want?

Still not sure what bigger financial issues outweigh illegal immigration as what benefits do we get financially from it?

You (and rightly so ) have been very critical in the money the Government are throwing at trying to curb illegal immigration but come the next general election when Labour get in it will be interesting to hear your views then because this topic is suddenly not going to disappear overnight with Labour in power.
Click to expand...
Compare the fines to the billions in dividends and the damage to the environment. They're literally taking the piss.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Another poor example again you’ve used as we are all at the mercy of water companies like the NHS.

But in answering it Water companies are rightly being fined for their errors.

Thames water authority were fined £35.7m for water pollution between 2017-23.

United Utilities we’re fined £800,000 in August 2023 for illegally abstracting 22 billion litres of water from Lancashire bore holes.

The list is endless but I’m happy to carry on if you want?

Still not sure what bigger financial issues outweigh illegal immigration as what benefits do we get financially from it?

You (and rightly so ) have been very critical in the money the Government are throwing at trying to curb illegal immigration but come the next general election when Labour get in it will be interesting to hear your views then because this topic is suddenly not going to disappear overnight with Labour in power.
Click to expand...
Immigrants paid far more in tax last year than the costs of putting up a few thousand people in boats (costs that were mainly paid to Tory donors, btw). It would have been cheaper to put them up in the Ritz than on that barge.
 
Wizaard said:
Immigrants paid far more in tax last year than the costs of putting up a few thousand people in boats (costs that were mainly paid to Tory donors, btw). It would have been cheaper to put them up in the Ritz than on that barge.
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And there lies the problem we shouldn’t be putting them up full stop we should be returning them to France where they illegally set off from.

Job done and we’re all of a sudden a billion pound better off. 👍
 
Get competitive tendering instead of money to mates, sort out the paperwork (95% of applications are granted) and have them working and paying taxes. Net profit. No need for hotels, boats etc if the border force is fully staffed.
 
tommytwojags said:
How much longer is the UK going to let France laugh at us while pocketing £500m of our money for controlling the movement of asylum seekers across the channel? Despite Manny Macron's assurance that extra manpower, drones and equipment would be assigned to prevent the life-risking movement of men, women and children, most without life jackets, the police turn a blind eye and another boatload leaves for Blighty.

Traffickers openly make deals of £3000 per person and 100 more cram into the death trap dinghy. £300,000 per crossing allows the organisers to buy more boats and carry more desperate passengers to the land of milk and honey.

Meanwhile, a cruise ship arrives in Barcelona with 69 Bolivian illegal immigrants. What does Spain do? It orders MSC Cruises to fly them back to Bolivia. Human rights my a**e.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/ne...S&cvid=09699937aae34d8da0c716b3cc8dac46&ei=45
Click to expand...
The most annoying thing that astounds me is the amount of money the government is spending and the fact the trafficking gangs are raking it in. The fact police,interpol or whatever other law agencies cannot find these gangs yet it seems like a migrant can easily get in touch as ordering a taxi is mind boggling.
 
tommytwojags said:
The UK sought agreement to patrol the Normandy coast and control illegal trafficking but France refused saying they would do it so long as the UK paid. It's not as though it's a difficult job. You stop them on the beach and seize their boats. If you look at the video in the OP you can see that the French police are openly encouraging the traffickers. Every single death in the Channel is the fault of France.
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Would we allow French police on UK beaches to stop people going back the other way to France?
 
tommytwojags said:
How much longer is the UK going to let France laugh at us while pocketing £500m of our money for controlling the movement of asylum seekers across the channel? Despite Manny Macron's assurance that extra manpower, drones and equipment would be assigned to prevent the life-risking movement of men, women and children, most without life jackets, the police turn a blind eye and another boatload leaves for Blighty.

Traffickers openly make deals of £3000 per person and 100 more cram into the death trap dinghy. £300,000 per crossing allows the organisers to buy more boats and carry more desperate passengers to the land of milk and honey.

Meanwhile, a cruise ship arrives in Barcelona with 69 Bolivian illegal immigrants. What does Spain do? It orders MSC Cruises to fly them back to Bolivia. Human rights my a**e.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/ne...S&cvid=09699937aae34d8da0c716b3cc8dac46&ei=45
Click to expand...
France has offered to open a processing centre on their side but all you RWNJ's screamed 'sovrinity innit' so it never happened. Enjoy your principles, in the meantime let's hope the next government handles things better. This is a global problem but the right refuse anything that involves collectivism as they're too busy proposing resigning from every global treaty in existence. The right never did grasp detail. If you don't believe me perhaps you'll listen to one of your own who does do detail. Things are always complex.
 
The government hasn’t got a clue how many people are coming into the country. As they haven’t with giving a toss about other issues especially when it comes to making a lot of money for themselves and their cronies.

An issue I do have is that we struggle to Dixie’s immigration in this country without it being classed as racism. Are people happy to have open borders? No limit to incoming people? I see there is an issue (amongst many others) that is putting pressure on services already squeezed be it by numbers of people or underfunding.
 
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Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
The government hasn’t got a clue how many people are coming into the country. As they haven’t with giving a toss about other issues especially when it comes to making a lot of money for themselves and their cronies.

An issue I do have is that we struggle to Dixie’s immigration in this country without it being classed as racism. Are people happy to have open borders? No limit to incoming people? I see there is an issue (amongst many others) that is putting pressure on services already squeezed be it by numbers of people or underfunding.
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The UK has time limits for tourists and without a visa you can't stay more than 180 days. Visas are limited to annual quotas per country for residency and work.

321,000 work visas were granted in total in 2023.
657,000 study visas granted in 2023

Why do you think borders are open and there are no limits on the numbers?

Every visa is very deliberately issued by the government, students are a cash cow, workers make the country function and pay tax.
 
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Bend it like Suddick said:
I can't as the migrant issue affects indirectly som many problems
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That is what you're told. How about accepting migration as necessary and entering a club that accepts free movement was actually a sensible way forward.
We cannot go on with a ageing population and declining birth rate. The two don't mix and mean an impending economic disaster, unless people have to work until they die or uk citizens massively increase having children or increase migration. Which one do you suggest? It has to be one of them to solve the solution.
 
Foolweary said:
The UK has time limits for tourists and without a visa you can't stay more than 180 days. Visas are limited to annual quotas per country for residency and work.

321,000 work visas were granted in total in 2023.
657,000 study visas granted in 2023
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That may be so, but I bet you could double those figures for people coming illegally - the government hasn’t a clue how many people are coming into the country each day.
 
Shandypants said:
That is what you're told. How about accepting migration as necessary and entering a club that accepts free movement was actually a sensible way forward.
We cannot go on with a ageing population and declining birth rate. The two don't mix and mean an impending economic disaster, unless people have to work until they die or uk citizens massively increase having children or increase migration. Which one do you suggest? It has to be one of them to solve the solution.
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Sorry Shandy but I envisage an impending disaster in the future with a big proportion of the migrants with no 'history' and potential criminal or terrorist threat.
 
Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
That may be so, but I bet you could double those figures for people coming illegally - the government hasn’t a clue how many people are coming into the country each day.
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You have no idea how many people arrive illegally and your ridiculous estimate is an emotional response to the ever more frantic manner some politicians are generating hysteria on the topic.

Why do you think you can accurately estimate the number when in the same sentence you state the government with all their resources and experience don't have a clue?
 
Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
That may be so, but I bet you could double those figures for people coming illegally - the government hasn’t a clue how many people are coming into the country each day.
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There is nowhere near a million coming in every year illegally. Last published figure was 28,000. Its a dog whistle tactic to distract and have someone to blame for 14 years of disastrous Tory rule that has destroyed the fabric of the country.
 
Wizaard said:
There is nowhere near a million coming in every year illegally. Last published figure was 28,000. Its a dog whistle tactic to distract and have someone to blame for 14 years of disastrous Tory rule that has destroyed the fabric of the country.
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It may be so Wiz but for years immigration/asylum seekers/illegal immigrants has been an issue that hasn’t been dealt with properly.
 
Foolweary said:
You have no idea how many people arrive illegally and your ridiculous estimate is an emotional response to the ever more frantic manner some politicians are generating hysteria on the topic.

Why do you think you can accurately estimate the number when in the same sentence you state the government with all their resources and experience don't have a clue?
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I’ve seen enough with my own eyes as well as on the news to know that the current incumbents are not in control of what is going on. That’s not an emotional or political response, it’s common sense.
 
Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
It may be so Wiz but for years immigration/asylum seekers/illegal immigrants has been an issue that hasn’t been dealt with properly.
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And who's been in charge for 14 years, took us out of Europe and still moan about lack of control. It's solely on them but they try and deflect while massively cutting resources of the Immigration bodies.

Doesn't stop them giving pointless contracts to Rwanda and hostel ships costing billions.
 
I agree Wiz - the whole Rwanda thing is pathetic. But I can guarantee Labour won’t get any better at handling the issue either as we cannot discuss immigration or asylum seekers/ illegal immigrants sensibly in this country without being accused of racism or being uncaring. I know think we are a soft touch here, having lived in Australia for two years and seen first hand how they handle their borders.
I hate the woman with a passion but Braverman was correct in pointing out what is coming in the next few decades as climate change and resources all start to take hold across the globe and people seek key countries to live in. I’m as anti-Tory as they come by the way.
 
The migration issue is testing nearly all governments in Europe and there is no simple solution as Labour know only too well or will soon find out. The EU is now under severe strain as its Parliament has voted to force member states to accept their quota of migrants. So yes, the UK does have control of its borders, unlike 27 EU countries, even if we refuse to control them.

However, the point of the OP was to show how the French police are aiding and abetting migrants in reaching the UK when for all intents and purposes they are being paid to prevent crossings and protect migrants' lives.
 
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Shandypants said:
That is what you're told. How about accepting migration as necessary and entering a club that accepts free movement was actually a sensible way forward.
We cannot go on with a ageing population and declining birth rate. The two don't mix and mean an impending economic disaster, unless people have to work until they die or uk citizens massively increase having children or increase migration. Which one do you suggest? It has to be one of them to solve the solution.
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removed, racist content.
 
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Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
I agree Wiz - the whole Rwanda thing is pathetic. But I can guarantee Labour won’t get any better at handling the issue either as we cannot discuss immigration or asylum seekers/ illegal immigrants sensibly in this country without being accused of racism or being uncaring. I know think we are a soft touch here, having lived in Australia for two years and seen first hand how they handle their borders.
I hate the woman with a passion but Braverman was correct in pointing out what is coming in the next few decades as climate change and resources all start to take hold across the globe and people seek key countries to live in. I’m as anti-Tory as they come by the way.
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I don’t hate Braverman.

Says how it is and because she does gets hammered by the lefty boys.

Good on her, we need more people not to be cowed
 
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