Just a few brief words on the NHS

So how much do you pay for your 'top end private cover' and what are the excesses, exclusions, etc ?
It’s a good job he has a top end policy if he lives in Singapore he won’t qualify for NHS treatment whenever he’s back, British or not, unless he still pays Taxes and finds a loophole.
 
It’s a good job he has a top end policy if he lives in Singapore he won’t qualify for NHS treatment whenever he’s back, British or not, unless he still pays Taxes and finds a loophole.
I pay £2.5k a year for a comprehensive global policy (non US) from AXA. This means I can be treated anywhere apart from the US unless it’s an emergency.

Tax rates here are effectively 6-7% on local earnings and a zero rate on dividends and CGT - comparatively it’s cheap.

I am covered for anything I need, there are exceptions to the policy for things I would never need like transgender re assignment - so nothing to worry about!!!!

Cover level is up to £1.5m or equivalent a year, with an excess of about 500 quid a year (not per claim).

In regards to the above, I would qualify for NHS treatment if I returned and re-entered the UK tax system, otherwise the insurance would simply pay.
 
Nevertheless, you are repeating what you've been told by the media rather than any actual real world experience.

Newsflash: not everything the media says is true.
Some real world experiences that I have seen/observed with my own eyes this year:
Nurses (yes, plural) coming into work immediately following a positive C-19 test result.
Managers tell their teams to not use T&T or to ignore notifications for work purposes.
GPs and other community teams phoning it in since April.
Poor knowledge/application of the law eg. refusing treatment to individuals who (legally and practically) cannot mask up.
DNRs put on people's records who have mental capacity and are not actually that old/infirm.

To name a few.

Look, I think we all appreciate the NHS and the work of the front line staff but let's call a spade a spade - in all walks of life you get a sprinkling of shirkers, mercenaries, those with questionable ethics, those that will exploit certain scenarios etc. Why would the NHS be any different? It's a service that we pay into, not a religion where those that don't worship enough are less holy.

To present a whitewashed version of the truth just makes people kick back against blatant bullshido.
 
Remember that this poster thinks that Boris Johnson is a decent bloke and not the corrupt lying narcissist that is happy to ignore bullying, that was willing to pass on information to get a journalist beaten up, a lazy coward who regularly goes missing, who rewards his cronies and sycophants at the expense of people's lives and has repeatedly made racist and homophobic comments throughout his career. I would suggest that we should not take his judgement particularly seriously.
 
Remember that this poster thinks that Boris Johnson is a decent bloke and not the corrupt lying narcissist that is happy to ignore bullying, that was willing to pass on information to get a journalist beaten up, a lazy coward who regularly goes missing, who rewards his cronies and sycophants at the expense of people's lives and has repeatedly made racist and homophobic comments throughout his career. I would suggest that we should not take his judgement particularly seriously.

You just make it up as you go along!
 
None of the statements about the mopheaded coward are made up.
...and where did I say I think he is a decent bloke since he screwed up the Covid response?

I have been more critical of him than most.

Anyway - what about the original question - do you think the NHS is fit for purpose??
 
Actually I think there are many failings. I'm still waiting for an appointment with Harefield hospital which was originally made for the summer of 2019 and has been cancelled and rearranged on five occasions to date. The difference is that I believe that the causes of such failures is ten years of austerity cuts and hiving off profitable services to the Tory donating private sector. I've also said that the mental health services and associated welfare state that supported me through a crisis back between 2010-2012 now no longer exist thanks to ten years of Conservative rule.
 
Actually I think there are many failings. I'm still waiting for an appointment with Harefield hospital which was originally made for the summer of 2019 and has been cancelled and rearranged on five occasions to date. The difference is that I believe that the causes of such failures is ten years of austerity cuts and hiving off profitable services to the Tory donating private sector. I've also said that the mental health services and associated welfare state that supported me through a crisis back between 2010-2012 now no longer exist thanks to ten years of Conservative rule.
Is it fit for purpose - Yes or no?
 
The NHS will have a massive boost to funding after brexit. An additional 350m per week was promised to entice voters. How many billion is that per year?
 
Sums your views up of the NHS then.

I bet there’s a good few more things wrong with our country then in your opinion.
I had major dealings with the NHS for a number of years with my dad before he passed - most my views come from that and what other people tell me of their own personal experience.

....and yes there is a lot wrong with the UK currently - and bluntly you would have to be rather blinkered to think otherwise.
 
I had major dealings with the NHS for a number of years with my dad before he passed - most my views come from that and what other people tell me of their own personal experience.

....and yes there is a lot wrong with the UK currently - and bluntly you would have to be rather blinkered to think otherwise.
Every country on the planet has its issues granted some more than others.
Unfortunately there’s no such a place as paradise where people don't have to work, don't need money, don’t grow old suffer terrible illnesses and die.
If you know of a place let me know and i’ll get the bags packed.
 
Every country on the planet has its issues granted some more than others.
Unfortunately there’s no such a place as paradise where people don't have to work, don't need money, don’t grow old suffer terrible illnesses and die.
I never said there was - you asked if thought the UK had issues and it does and I said you would have blinkers on to think otherwise!!

I will start with the following....

1 NHS can’t cope
2 An incompetent PM / Government
3 Financially screwed / massive economic problems
4 Unemployment levels
5 Knife crime
6 Michael Gove
7 Obesity
8 The me and now culture of many
9 Network rail or whatever it’s called now
10 The youth of today (that’s probably my age!)

....anyway that’s just to start - and I haven’t really mentioned Brexit.
 
Given the NHS is something like the 5th largest employer on the planet I have the following thoughts.

It's not really an NHS, it's a franchise model of a non-alinged hotch potch of medical services.

It's not even about health, it's about sickness.

Where you live dictates the quality of the service you get and even that can vary depending on the nature of what is wrong with you.

It will swallow up as much money as you can throw at it and it still wouldn't be enough.

Given the political romance surrounding it, it is infected with the same institutional cover up mentality which affects must other public sector bodies. Far, far too many times do we hear of "lessons being learned" as poor processes and a fear kill people/allow them to die of curable illnesses. As an institution it is completely unaccountable and senior management/Directors do whatever they want with impunity.

In most industries behaviour like this is stamped out. Look at the way the world turned on Boeing when they lied about the Max aircraft.

The institution of the NHS has essentially just created the conditions during Covid where old people were considered disposable and that makes me sick.

All of that said

I love the free at point of use provision (if you don't include being fleeced for prescriptions, dentistry, opticians etc.)

I love the fact that if I dial 999 an ambulance will come and take me, if I need it, to a place where they should be able to make me well.

I love that we can protect our most vulnerable citizens and we don't consider the cost of children with life limiting illnesses for example.

It requires a reset to be fit for the rest of this century; how we use AI etc could transform it BUT I'm not sure there is the political will or public desire to move away from the romance of the service nor to shift away from sickness to being able to live better and weller for longer.
 
Last edited:
An interesting debate which is obviously influenced on all sides by personal experience. It seems clear that there is massive inefficiency in the way the NHS is run.I recall some years ago Geoffrey Robinson {I think it was) a well respected successful business man going inside the NHS and making a TV series about the many sensible rational constructive ways in which the NHS could be improved and made more efficient but to attempt to do so was like banging your head against a brick wall .Clearly there is a huge amount of waste in the NHS.

I don` t live in Blackpool but in Sheffield where we have a dedicated cancer hospital where I`ve recently completed 3 years treatment for prostate cancer including almost 8 weeks of daily radiotherapy.In that time I could not have asked for more in the way my treatment was carried out and by by the excellent staff who cared for me.My cancer is now in remission and please god it stays there.

My mother died in Victoria hospital where my brother who did live locally had to go in each evening after work to help her and ensure she was able to eat her meal as otherwise the nurses,who no doubt were busy ,would otherwise unquestioningly just take it away uneaten each time. She was the most stoical uncomplaining person you could ever meet.I thought some of her care there was below what you would hope for and expect.Having said that I was with her when she died and there was a nurse that day who was very kind.

Grateful though we are for the NHS like any organisation it needs to be constantly scrutinised, assessed and improved or it`s efficiency will inevitably decline and it will achieve far less than its massive budget and our expectations should demand.

So we all have our own take on the NHS.No doubt it could be improved with the right attitudes from its staff at the top but we are also very grateful for what we`ve got and I`m very aware that but for the treatment I received I might not even be here to tell this tale.
 
seasideone raised some good points relating to the NHS which were valid regardless of any personal experience and certainly worthy of discussion/debate.

Sadly they were ignored/deflected and we turned to his place of residence as if that has anything to do with anything.

I'd imagine that it's perfectly possible that:


some folk are happy with the service that they have received from the NHS,

seasideone resides in Singapore,

the NHS is no longer fit for purpose.


To be fair to seasideone, he couldn't have used his "it's not the front line staff as they are excellent" caveat any more if he had tried.

Many of the positives of the NHS have been highlighted on the thread and some are clearly proud of the organisation but surely it is going to have to adapt to address the challenges that seasideone describes and that is the case whether or not it is privatised and whether or not any individual has good personal experiences.
 
An interesting debate which is obviously influenced on all sides by personal experience. It seems clear that there is massive inefficiency in the way the NHS is run.I recall some years ago Geoffrey Robinson {I think it was) a well respected successful business man going inside the NHS and making a TV series about the many sensible rational constructive ways in which the NHS could be improved and made more efficient but to attempt to do so was like banging your head against a brick wall .Clearly there is a huge amount of waste in the NHS.

I don` t live in Blackpool but in Sheffield where we have a dedicated cancer hospital where I`ve recently completed 3 years treatment for prostate cancer including almost 8 weeks of daily radiotherapy.In that time I could not have asked for more in the way my treatment was carried out and by by the excellent staff who cared for me.My cancer is now in remission and please god it stays there.

My mother died in Victoria hospital where my brother who did live locally had to go in each evening after work to help her and ensure she was able to eat her meal as otherwise the nurses,who no doubt were busy ,would otherwise unquestioningly just take it away uneaten each time. She was the most stoical uncomplaining person you could ever meet.I thought some of her care there was below what you would hope for and expect.Having said that I was with her when she died and there was a nurse that day who was very kind.

Grateful though we are for the NHS like any organisation it needs to be constantly scrutinised, assessed and improved or it`s efficiency will inevitably decline and it will achieve far less than its massive budget and our expectations should demand.

So we all have our own take on the NHS.No doubt it could be improved with the right attitudes from its staff at the top but we are also very grateful for what we`ve got and I`m very aware that but for the treatment I received I might not even be here to tell this tale.

50s

Permission to agree with you ?

I wouldn't have had to make my post if I'd seen your post first.
 
I never said there was - you asked if thought the UK had issues and it does and I said you would have blinkers on to think otherwise!!

I will start with the following....

1 NHS can’t cope
2 An incompetent PM / Government
3 Financially screwed / massive economic problems
4 Unemployment levels
5 Knife crime
6 Michael Gove
7 Obesity
8 The me and now culture of many
9 Network rail or whatever it’s called now
10 The youth of today (that’s probably my age!)

....anyway that’s just to start - and I haven’t really mentioned Brexit.

That's a hell of a pair of binoculars you've got there.
 
It's not even about health, it's about sickness.

It will swallow up as much money as you can throw at it and it still wouldn't be enough.
Just a couple of points, I’ve picked on here...

Firstly, it is not just the U.K. that has tended to focus on sickness and prescribing as opposed to health and preventing. That said, I do think attitudes and approachare shifting.

On the second point, I’m not sure you are being fair. The implication from your point is that the NHS fails to deliver value for money and I’m not convinced that is necessary he case... The cost of our NHS per capita works out at around half the cost per capita of US citizens via an insurance based system,

I certainly don’t think further investment in the NHS would be ‘swallowed up’, but instead deliver additional value and valuable services to the British Public.

Of course, there is always room for improvement and increased efficiency, but on the whole, it’s a service that works extremely well for the overwhelming majority of those who need to use it.

I get that the likes of S1 who essentially can choose to spend his way up any priority list might be frustrated with waiting more than 15 minutes to have a butterfly stitch on his paper cut finger, but, on balance, it works.
 
I pay £2.5k a year for a comprehensive global policy (non US) from AXA. This means I can be treated anywhere apart from the US unless it’s an emergency.

Tax rates here are effectively 6-7% on local earnings and a zero rate on dividends and CGT - comparatively it’s cheap.

I am covered for anything I need, there are exceptions to the policy for things I would never need like transgender re assignment - so nothing to worry about!!!!

Cover level is up to £1.5m or equivalent a year, with an excess of about 500 quid a year (not per claim).

In regards to the above, I would qualify for NHS treatment if I returned and re-entered the UK tax system, otherwise the insurance would simply pay.
Seems a decent policy, regards the NHS I think you’d find it difficult , many ex pats returning from Spain have encountered this.
 
Next time your over this way seasideone do me a favour stop off in Calais and tell all those refugees the NHS is crap and certainly not worth risking your lives for crossing the channel in a rubber dinghy. 👍
 
Last edited:
Seems a decent policy, regards the NHS I think you’d find it difficult , many ex pats returning from Spain have encountered this.
According to the government website it is pretty easy ..... as a UK citizen I have the right to live in the UK and receive NHS care once I reside back.

Obviously if I turn up on holiday and try and get a selective op I cannot use the NHS, although the insurance would pay.

Emergency care is different and I get that free whatever the situation.

I can’t really comment on the Spanish example as I do not know the circumstances BUT if they just turn up expecting care when living abroad they would get a flat no.
 
Next time your over this way seasideone do me a favour stop off in Calais and tell all those refugees the NHS is crap and certainly not worth risking your lives crossing the channel in a rubber dinghy. 👍
Another ridiculous comment 😔

I would obviously advise they buy an AXA policy 👍
 
I never said there was - you asked if thought the UK had issues and it does and I said you would have blinkers on to think otherwise!!

I will start with the following....

1 NHS can’t cope
2 An incompetent PM / Government
3 Financially screwed / massive economic problems
4 Unemployment levels
5 Knife crime
6 Michael Gove
7 Obesity
8 The me and now culture of many
9 Network rail or whatever it’s called now
10 The youth of today (that’s probably my age!)

....anyway that’s just to start - and I haven’t really mentioned Brexit.
Crikey, best if you stay away then 😂
I, for one, was born and bred here - and love holidays but don't want to "live" anywhere else👍
 
Concerns of Covid19 being at the top of most peoples thoughts, just a few words on my experiences with the health service in recent weeks.
I have had four hospital visits along with several covid tests since early October and on every occasion to be first class in every way.
As an example yesterday I had a seven hour stint in the day surgery and from the moment I saw the first nurse along with others, doctors and anaesthetists and from recovery to leaving, the whole experience was first class, I did wonder how they manage to smile and keep going in the way they do working such long hours and the obvious dedication they have for the work that they do.
I spoke over the weekend to one of my old neighbours in the States, he was recovering from Cancer and although having company insurance he was having to pay 25% of his medical costs, I cannot recall how much the operation was but the chemo he was having was $10k a month and therefore costing him $2.5 k and only able to work part time, thus on a reduced salary.
We have something in this country, it is called the NHS, we may kick and scream at times but generally it is a service we just couldn't do without, it has to be protected..
Well said, and bear in mind this week we learn that a 14 year old is taking the NHS to court because his/her sex change treatment has been delayed !!!
 
Back
Top