Howe and Thorniley free to leave

Tangerine Pip

Well-known member
They were Grayson signings I suppose, but isn't the point of the recruitment team that there is continuity even if a "head coach" is to leave - another one can come in that will share the ethos of the club, and on that token not cause the usual disruption that happens with the departure and changing hands of a new traditional manager..

This is a prime example of that not happening. Must be frustrating for Sadler knowing he's forking out for players on a two year deal for 12 months later after making barely any appearances they're told that they are free to leave
Tommy Johnson Same recruiter/scout
 

tangerine_neil

Well-known member
This has aged well


Chief Executive Ben Mansford said:
“Jordan has been one of our main targets for the winter window, so we are delighted to have this sorted at this early stage. Jordan comes having had a good upbringing at Everton and he has continued to develop after moving to Sheffield Wednesday. As well as being impressed with Jordan as a footballer, we were also impressed with his desire to come and play for Blackpool FC.

“It is crucial that we recruit players that want to be with us and commit to helping the Club realise its ambitions over the forthcoming seasons. Jordan comes highly regarded by those that have worked with him and we are all looking forward to welcoming him to Bloomfield Road."
I don’t / can’t believe they ever saw him play.
Reminds me of when Ollie was signing players based on recommendations from his wife and DVD clips.
 

BlackpoolsFinest

Well-known member
Some strange comments on here, two players that just won’t make the grade that NC is looking for and the manager/board are getting some flak. Oh ok then let’s keep paying big wages for 2 more years for a couple of duffers. Sounds like good business.
Always the same.
So 2 signings made during a January transfer window under a different manager haven't worked out..... big deal.
SS will continue to back Critch and his back room team to bring in players, does he seem overly bothered, or does he understand that some signings work out, and some don't?
I honestly wonder whether some people understand the bigger picture of how football works, and not just simply :
"x hasn't worked out - everybody and everything is shit"

Yet another stick to try and beat the club with.
 

Rektseasider

Well-known member
Always the same.
So 2 signings made during a January transfer window under a different manager haven't worked out..... big deal.
SS will continue to back Critch and his back room team to bring in players, does he seem overly bothered, or does he understand that some signings work out, and some don't?
I honestly wonder whether some people understand the bigger picture of how football works, and not just simply :
"x hasn't worked out - everybody and everything is shit"

Yet another stick to try and beat the club with.
Finest I think you’re making it too simplistic.

Transfers are always a gamble, some signings will fail, at every club, every year. I think most people acknowledge that.

However to present it as two signings from a previous manager just didn’t work out is hiding the actual picture of the transfers in and out under the new ownership. Again I think most people realise that the new ownership has bought itself a lot of capital with the fans and they can accept bad transfers for a few years whilst the club gets on its feet.

But at the same time, and with the last decade of shocking management in our minds, I think it now falls to the fan base to always question what the club does and how it operates, precisely to avoid a repeat of the last decade.

The two signings mention, if in isolation could be put down to being, just one of those things. However if you then add them to the ever growing number of players that seem to only be with the club 12 months or under, people I think correctly, should be quietly questioning how we operate in this area, with a mind that whilst that capital is still with us it can’t last forever because we even we don’t have an endless money pit.

If this pattern continues, it will be evident to everyone including SS that it’s not just ‘one of those things’ and the club needs to operator in a different manner to be successful.

This isn’t a pop at you finest as I often agree with much of your writing. It’s just to say we as a fan base should always be alert, now more than ever, to possible symptoms of mismanagement at the club.

Having said that, I do think, after some muddled transfer windows we’re starting to get things right.
 

The_Busted_Flush

Well-known member
They were Grayson signings I suppose, but isn't the point of the recruitment team that there is continuity even if a "head coach" is to leave - another one can come in that will share the ethos of the club, and on that token not cause the usual disruption that happens with the departure and changing hands of a new traditional manager..

This is a prime example of that not happening. Must be frustrating for Sadler knowing he's forking out for players on a two year deal for 12 months later after making barely any appearances they're told that they are free to leave Must be frustrating but if that’s a big enough frustration for him he
They were Grayson signings I suppose, but isn't the point of the recruitment team that there is continuity even if a "head coach" is to leave - another one can come in that will share the ethos of the club, and on that token not cause the usual disruption that happens with the departure and changing hands of a new traditional manager..

This is a prime example of that not happening. Must be frustrating for Sadler knowing he's forking out for players on a two year deal for 12 months later after making barely any appearances they're told that they are free to leave
Nature of owning a football club. If it’s that big of a frustration for him he shouldn’t have sacked Grayson so quickly.
 

BlackpoolsFinest

Well-known member
Finest I think you’re making it too simplistic.

Transfers are always a gamble, some signings will fail, at every club, every year. I think most people acknowledge that.

However to present it as two signings from a previous manager just didn’t work out is hiding the actual picture of the transfers in and out under the new ownership. Again I think most people realise that the new ownership has bought itself a lot of capital with the fans and they can accept bad transfers for a few years whilst the club gets on its feet.

But at the same time, and with the last decade of shocking management in our minds, I think it now falls to the fan base to always question what the club does and how it operates, precisely to avoid a repeat of the last decade.

The two signings mention, if in isolation could be put down to being, just one of those things. However if you then add them to the ever growing number of players that seem to only be with the club 12 months or under, people I think correctly, should be quietly questioning how we operate in this area, with a mind that whilst that capital is still with us it can’t last forever because we even we don’t have an endless money pit.

If this pattern continues, it will be evident to everyone including SS that it’s not just ‘one of those things’ and the club needs to operator in a different manner to be successful.

This isn’t a pop at you finest as I often agree with much of your writing. It’s just to say we as a fan base should always be alert, now more than ever, to possible symptoms of mismanagement at the club.

Having said that, I do think, after some muddled transfer windows we’re starting to get things right.
I didn't take it as a pop, you make points that I agree with:
If we continue to sign random, and make no mistake about it they do seem to have been random, players, then questions should definitely be asked; we aren't sitting on a Chelsea/City or even Leicester sized pot of money that will fund our rise up the league pyramid with little regard to poor or wasted signings.
However, I do think we have seen measured improvements after the initial scramble of arrivals under Critch.
I am genuinely happy to disregard what went on before then because it was a very strange time for everyone connected to the club, and you have to give them the benefit of the doubt that they were on a very steep learning curve. The club seemed rudderless, a perfect example being everything that Grayson appeared to epitomise in his second spell here.
I think since Critch first went on his Championship Manager-style spree of seemingly signing anyone who was under 23 with pace that things have settled down, and the arrivals since have been more measured. We'll never know the reason for him bringing in so many players in such a short space of time, but my opinion is it was a mixture of him not really being impressed with what was presently at the club, getting a bit giddy over having a pot of money and a very accomodating owner, added to the fact he wanted players in quickly to bed them in before the already disrupted pre season got underway.

Things should settle down more; hopefully the fact only one player, filling a role we require, has arrived suggest they have.
 

poolseasider

Well-known member
Finest I think you’re making it too simplistic.

Transfers are always a gamble, some signings will fail, at every club, every year. I think most people acknowledge that.

However to present it as two signings from a previous manager just didn’t work out is hiding the actual picture of the transfers in and out under the new ownership. Again I think most people realise that the new ownership has bought itself a lot of capital with the fans and they can accept bad transfers for a few years whilst the club gets on its feet.

But at the same time, and with the last decade of shocking management in our minds, I think it now falls to the fan base to always question what the club does and how it operates, precisely to avoid a repeat of the last decade.

The two signings mention, if in isolation could be put down to being, just one of those things. However if you then add them to the ever growing number of players that seem to only be with the club 12 months or under, people I think correctly, should be quietly questioning how we operate in this area, with a mind that whilst that capital is still with us it can’t last forever because we even we don’t have an endless money pit.

If this pattern continues, it will be evident to everyone including SS that it’s not just ‘one of those things’ and the club needs to operator in a different manner to be successful.

This isn’t a pop at you finest as I often agree with much of your writing. It’s just to say we as a fan base should always be alert, now more than ever, to possible symptoms of mismanagement at the club.

Having said that, I do think, after some muddled transfer windows we’re starting to get things right.
Good post you just can't keep throwing good money down the toilet on signings you'd expect to be pushing to get in the first team.
These two where signed in January not the summer where might want to develop someone over the season in cup games etc and the odd sub appearance they where both supposed to start games.
 

Grayth

Well-known member
I think Sadler was met with a choice when it became clear Grayson was going down the pan and the "product" was becoming more and more godawful.

When he sacked Grayson and appointed Critchley, he must have realised doing so would involve a certain amount of squad overhaul. This was especially the case as - given the coaches linked with the club - he sought to improve the style of play.

He committed to the re-investment when he sacked Grayson and appointed Critchley, knowing he was looking for someone to improve the style of play. Thorniley was inevitably going to be a victim of this, as he lacks the pace to play effectively in our system. Howe is less clear, but it seems more of a matter of the manager's personal opinion. As an attacking fullback, he might suit the style of play, were he good enough (in the eyes of Critch) to play at this level at all!

Unless I'm mistaken, the recruitment team is largely the same under Critch as it was under Grayson. The work they did for Grayson has pretty much gone out of the window as a result of his sacking. It's not necessarily a reflection on their work, but the direction of the club as a whole. So in that sense, there probably is some blame that lies with Sadler. But it's his money he's spending to get it right, so I'm not complaining.

The recruitment team does look to have made some dodgy signings, so they're not blameless. It's just not quite as cut and dried for me as "we've only just signed these players and now we're binning them so they must be crap players."
 

Class_of_2010

Well-known member
How can you expect a player to be fully commited on a Saturday after telling him he isn't needed the day before. Absolute madness.
 

M61Exile

Well-known member
Best scenario is Thorniley has a stormer so he takes a valuable place in squad or we get interest in offloading him.
I said earlier in thread until we have replacements we should keep him.
I thought he did OK to be fair - will probably go sooner than Howe on that performance.
 

SIDEFOOT_SID

Well-known member
I thought he did OK to be fair - will probably go sooner than Howe on that performance.
Agree with that. He put in a decent solid performance yesterday.
Certainly better than I had expected based on some of the 'expert' analysis that I have read on here recently. Well done Thorniley
 

BlackpoolsFinest

Well-known member
It does seem strange to be thinking of allowing Thorniley to leave given our current injury/covid issues. I thought he gave a decent account of himself yesterday, certainly enough to justify his spot in the squad as the 4th choice centre half.

Critch's thinking may be that as we have limited squad space, and having both Turton & Husband as being capable (I use that term loosely) of playing in the middle, means Thorniley's place would be better filled by someone who can play in a different position.

If whoever replaces him in the squad is capable of contributing to the starting XI then ship him out ASAP. If we're just gonna roll the dice with someone who will play a bit part, then keep Thorniley, this squad has had enough churn as it is already.
 

Rektseasider

Well-known member
Thorneily yesterday had an impressive game. Tackling, positional awareness and effort were all spot on. Against some very good players. That was like night and day compared to the last time I saw him.

If he can be dismissed so easily when he is capable of putting in that performance, it raises a few more awkward questions.

The thing that stood out for me was, he got hooked after 70 odd minutes, which was completely undeserved. In his place we put a questionable left back at centre back and we got completely overrun for the last 15 minutes.

Even though there wasn’t much on the game from our point of view it was tactically inept and smacked of a stubborn and naive personality.
 

BlackpoolsFinest

Well-known member
Thorneily yesterday had an impressive game. Tackling, positional awareness and effort were all spot on. Against some very good players. That was like night and day compared to the last time I saw him.

If he can be dismissed so easily when he is capable of putting in that performance, it raises a few more awkward questions.

The thing that stood out for me was, he got hooked after 70 odd minutes, which was completely undeserved. In his place we put a questionable left back at centre back and we got completely overrun for the last 15 minutes.

Even though there wasn’t much on the game from our point of view it was tactically inept and smacked of a stubborn and naive personality.
There is nothing wrong with having the strength to back up your beliefs or convictions, all the very top managers do it. The difference between them and Critch is that they have the success to show for it.
As it stands all we seem to be seeing is error after error, with not much seemingly being taken in and learnt from.
I desperately want to see this as part of a bigger picture, but it appears to be rinse and repeat almost weekly. If the rest of this season peters out with more frustrating performances game after game, there is going to be very little to look forward to in the summer other than another boat load of signings and departures.
 

Hazi

Well-known member
I think both will be dropped from the squad to make room for new recruits whether they find a club or not
 

Rektseasider

Well-known member
There is nothing wrong with having the strength to back up your beliefs or convictions, all the very top managers do it. The difference between them and Critch is that they have the success to show for it.
As it stands all we seem to be seeing is error after error, with not much seemingly being taken in and learnt from.
I desperately want to see this as part of a bigger picture, but it appears to be rinse and repeat almost weekly. If the rest of this season peters out with more frustrating performances game after game, there is going to be very little to look forward to in the summer other than another boat load of signings and departures.
Yes that is very true and I wouldn’t mind it, if as you say it’s part of a wider plan.

But hooking Thorneily yesterday and leaving us totally open for the last part of the game, had no logic or logical outcome to it.

It really did just smack of a coach not liking a player and wanting to make a point, which came at the detriment to the team. Not a good sign to me that.
 

BlackpoolsFinest

Well-known member
I think both will be dropped from the squad to make room for new recruits whether they find a club or not
Do you know if we are currently in a "grace period" during the window where we can have more than the allowed players in the squad until the window closes and then the official one is set until the end of the season? Is that a thing?

It would make sense to drop Howe from the squad as he clearly isn't gonna feature, but ideally we should keep Thorniley available until further signings arrive.
 

TangerinePeel

Well-known member
Critchley has spoke to the Gazette about his start:

The defender was handed a rare start on Saturday, only his fifth of the season, as the Seasiders bowed out of the cup at the fourth round stage following a 2-1 defeat.

With Daniel Gretarsson out injured and Dan Ballard missing, the 24-year-old grasped his opportunity playing in the centre of Blackpool’s back three.

The former Sheffield Wednesday man, who Critchley revealed last week is free to leave if another club comes in for him, performed well alongside Marvin Ekpiteta and James Husband.

Thorniley has yet to make a single league appearance this season.

“I thought he along with the rest of the team performed admirably,” Critchley told The Gazette.

“What I know about Jordan is that he’s a top professional and I knew he wouldn’t be lacking for his mentality or his attitude.

“We changed the shape and went to a back three and Jordan is used to playing in that.”
 

BlackpoolsFinest

Well-known member
Yes that is very true and I wouldn’t mind it, if as you say it’s part of a wider plan.

But hooking Thorneily yesterday and leaving us totally open for the last part of the game, had no logic or logical outcome to it.

It really did just smack of a coach not liking a player and wanting to make a point, which came at the detriment to the team. Not a good sign to me that.
I totally agree. We're now almost halfway through the season, we should be seeing marked improvement in certain areas, such as use of substitutions. It is a steep learning curve admittedly, but all Critch appears to have in his locker is throw 3 players on at the same time, disrupting the flow and rarely improving how the team then go on to perform. If anything it slows everything down.
 

Rektseasider

Well-known member
I totally agree. We're now almost halfway through the season, we should be seeing marked improvement in certain areas, such as use of substitutions. It is a steep learning curve admittedly, but all Critch appears to have in his locker is throw 3 players on at the same time, disrupting the flow and rarely improving how the team then go on to perform. If anything it slows everything down.
Can’t disagree with that finest.

It was all very odd, and I thought just a surrender in a game where we had an outside chance of getting something.
But it doesn’t matter I never want to see a BFC manager surrender a game and just give up.
 

tangysider

Well-known member
Did not watch the match, the consensus on here was Critch does not like Thorniley as he does not pass the ball out from the back but just clears his lines. Is that true from what others saw, and do we need 2 ball playing CB's?
 

poolfc

Well-known member
Did not watch the match, the consensus on here was Critch does not like Thorniley as he does not pass the ball out from the back but just clears his lines. Is that true from what others saw, and do we need 2 ball playing CB's?
Yes he's not rated him since his first week here. Hasn't been included in anything serious when there's been a choice. Even yesterday with the formation change he was the defensive sub off despite doing OK and nothing untoward happening. Not trusted in a back four.

Think it was this game that put NC off the idea
 
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