Denise Welch blasts the Covid scaremongering

I must admit as a parent of 2 lads in uni, one of whom is just starting, the care home comment / headline was crass and completely unnecessary.
 
Oh, I never as far as listening to the doctor. Too shouty, talking over the presenter, not the way to win friends and influence people.
 
Wizaard said:
Always good to take medical advice from someone off Loose Women sacked for being constantly pissed.
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Bit harsh !!

She’s struggled with depression and has been open about her substance abuse. I’m pretty sure she’s been tea total for several years.

Her recent book on her experience with Mental Health issues was a best seller and she is clearly passionate about the cause and does a lot to promote the cause.
 
Something ironic about a medically unqualified expat in the Algarve advising the UK on how poor its pandemic advice is.

What does the GC say?
 
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She wasn’t questioning any medical experts findings, she was questioning the media’s use of that data, in fact.
She made some very good points imo.
As Bifster said, she is very knowledgable and experienced in mental health issues - you don’t have to be a doctor to be in that position, else we might as well get rid of the vast majority of mental health support workers.
 
Wizaard said:
Always good to take medical advice from someone off Loose Women sacked for being constantly pissed.
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To be fair she paid a visit to the West Coast Rock cafe when southshorepool was there.
I think he and the Tangobears caught them in a Carling based pincer movement where there was little alternative 😀
 
She's concerned about mental health issues and has experienced many herself, but she's not in a position to preach about coronavirus. As most positive cases now concern young people they are the main risk of infection, so the onus is on them to self-distance and wear masks. If it upsets them that's tough.
 
Tangojoe said:
She's concerned about mental health issues and has experienced many herself, but she's not in a position to preach about coronavirus. As most positive cases now concern young people they are the main risk of infection, so the onus is on them to self-distance and wear masks. If it upsets them that's tough.
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She wasn’t preaching about the virus, she was preaching about the media’s interpretation of the data.
 
Johnno said:
She wasn’t preaching about the virus, she was preaching about the media’s interpretation of the data.
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That's not true though is it. She said she was shocked and appalled by the way the government and the media have represented the virus to the people. She also complained that for five months we've had a rolling death count every day. She might be worried about the effect the information could have on mental health but surely not making announcements would have been even worse. Then the scientists and the govt would have been accused of a cover up.
 
Tangojoe said:
That's not true though is it. She said she was shocked and appalled by the way the government and the media have represented the virus to the people. She also complained that for five months we've had a rolling death count every day. She might be worried about the effect the information could have on mental health but surely not making announcements would have been even worse. Then the scientists and the govt would have been accused of a cover up.
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She didn’t quite say that though, did she? She complained that we’ve had a rolling death count, until the figures weren’t worrying enough, then we started to get a rolling infection count, without any media outlet taking the positive stance by telling us the death count was minimal. I.E. tell the public the most frightening statistic, not the most positive one.
 
Johnno said:
She didn’t quite say that though, did she? She complained that we’ve had a rolling death count, until the figures weren’t worrying enough, then we started to get a rolling infection count, without any media outlet taking the positive stance by telling us the death count was minimal. I.E. tell the public the most frightening statistic, not the most positive one.
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I quoted exactly what she said. You can interpret it differently if you want
 
Tangojoe said:
I quoted exactly what she said. You can interpret it differently if you want
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Sorry mate, but she didn’t simply complain about having a rolling death count, she complained that the media only publicised the Covid death count, whilst ignoring the rolling death count of cancer, suicides, anorexia etc. Her rant was about ignoring other major ailments that are causing more deaths at the moment than Covid.
 
I get both sides of the argument on this one,
The death rate now is well below that of your average flu fatalities and combine that with all the other illness related deaths at the moment and she makes a.fair point regarding the ongoing media hysteria and reporting based purely around Covid.
That said it pays to stay vigilant, always, and the government know only too well that if they don’t prioritise Covid now then any future winter peak will lead to a media annihilation of their handling of the virus.
 
Johnno said:
Sorry mate, but she didn’t simply complain about having a rolling death count, she complained that the media only publicised the Covid death count, whilst ignoring the rolling death count of cancer, suicides, anorexia etc. Her rant was about ignoring other major ailments that are causing more deaths at the moment than Covid.
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Why would the published death rate include cancer, suicides and anorexia? They’re not infectious diseases. The whole point is to stop the virus spreading. Announcing how many people are dying of heart attacks etc would serve no purpose. The public want to know what their Coronavirus risks are.
 
How exactly does the daily Covid death count and continuous focus on negative data help anyone ?

It’s actually counterproductive, because many people ultimately become weary of living in a state of constant fear and just end up adopting a “Fuck It” attitude.

The key to dealing with this virus and public compliance is in developing trust between Government & the people.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
How exactly does the daily Covid death count and continuous focus on negative data help anyone ?
It’s actually counterproductive, because many people ultimately become weary of living in a state of constant fear and just end up adopting a “Fuck It” attitude.
The key to dealing with this virus and public compliance is in developing trust between Government & the people.
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Trust between government and people involves being told where the virus outbreaks are and imposing restrictions in those places. Seems to be working at the moment. How can that be counterproductive?
 
Tangojoe said:
Trust between government and people involves being told where the virus outbreaks are and imposing restrictions in those places. Seems to be working at the moment. How can that be counterproductive?
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No, trust between Government and people involves practicing what you preach and honesty as opposed to propaganda.
 
If you look at what the CDC have been forced to admit in their latest update that only 6% of deaths recorded were as a result of COVID19 and then you look at what the President Italian health institute said weeks ago 12% of Italian deaths as a result of COVID19. Apply that to our death statistics. Apply that to the American statistics.

Here is the official CDC document admitting 6% deaths result of COVID.

COVID-19 Provisional Counts - Weekly Updates by Select Demographic and Geographic Characteristics

Tabulated data on provisional COVID-19 deaths by age, sex, race and Hispanic origin, and comorbidities. Also includes an index of state-level and county-level mortality data available for download.
www.cdc.gov www.cdc.gov

EUmGOPrX0AU1EyY
 
I suppose the so called “negativity” or “scaremongering” the Government and the
Media are being accused of has to do with the message the Government want to send out.

The last thing they want to do is give the impression the pandemic is beaten and the risks are all behind us. Especially when the consensus is that it’s likely to return with a vengeance come the winter; a time when the NHS struggles to cope with seasonal flu anyway. Hence the “don’t drop your guard” message.

Let’s face it; there are enough people around already who are desperate to get back to the way things were without sending out the message that everything is on the up. The last thing the Government wants is for them to be able to point at the telly and say “See!!!! Even the BBC agrees with me!!! I’m off to that snogathon party and stuff social distancing”.
 
Tangojoe said:
Nothing at all to do with the topic under discussion.
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Don’t be ridiculous.... It’s everything to do with what is under discussion... Have you actually watched the clip?

Our Government and media has used propaganda,
and fear in order to manipulate the public. Compare that to say Sweden, where their government has treat the public like adults.... I suppose you Pays your money and takes your choice!!

As far as the media is concerned, I’ve quoted numerous headlines on here, which have been way OTT and misrepresented the reality.

And it’s all well and good people saying it’s the media’s job or that the Government needed to get people to respond. The fact is that anyone who has been equally irresponsible, with an opposing message, has been jumped on and/ or shut down.

Ultimately, it is irresponsible and whilst it may have created a one off response from the public, unlike Sweden, where the trust built beteen public and government will see them sustain measures over the long term, in the U.K. that trust has completely broken down for many.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Don’t be ridiculous.... It’s everything to do with what is under discussion... Have you actually watched the clip?

Our Government and media has used propaganda,
and fear in order to manipulate the public. Compare that to say Sweden, where their government has treat the public like adults.... I suppose you Pays your money and takes your choice!!

As far as the media is concerned, I’ve quoted numerous headlines on here, which have been way OTT and misrepresented the reality.

And it’s all well and good people saying it’s the media’s job or that the Government needed to get people to respond. The fact is that anyone who has been equally irresponsible, with an opposing message, has been jumped on and/ or shut down.

Ultimately, it is irresponsible and whilst it may have created a one off response from the public, unlike Sweden, where the trust built beteen public and government will see them sustain measures over the long term, in the U.K. that trust has completely broken down for many.
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"..unlike Sweden, where trust built between public and government will see them sustain measures over the long term..."

Not entirely sure you`re on completely solid ground with that statement, Bifster...
 
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spudgun said:

"..unlike Sweden, where trust built between public and government will see them sustain measures over the long term..."

Not entirely sure your on completely solid ground with that statement, Bifster...
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I suspect that will start to shift again over the coming months. It appears that Sweden are now bucking the trend as far as this so called ‘second wave’ is concerned.

It would be interesting to see what relative levels of compliance look like within different countries.

Maybe whipping the public into hysteria is the right policy.
 
"I suspect that will start to shift again over the coming months."

Always glad to hear your opinions, but they are only that - opinions, and in this case polling facts undermine the central premise of your statement at the moment.

"Whipping the public into hysteria" is rarely a good idea, and is usually from the playbook of the dictator, or in Trump`s case, wannabe dictator.

I assume that was a little tongue in cheek...😉
 
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spudgun said:
"I suspect that will start to shift again over the coming months."

Always glad to hear your opinions, but polling facts undermine the central premise of your statement at the moment.

"Whipping the public into hysteria" is rarely a good idea, and is usually from the playbook of the dictator, or in Trump`s case, wannabe dictator.

I assume that was a little tongue in cheek...😉
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A little tongue in cheek, but not entirely...

It’s difficult, because arguably (or statistically) a greater percentage of people in the U.K. trust the government than in Sweden, based on limited polling (though of course, trust can mean / relate to different things and the way a question is asked).

Despite that, arguably Britain is more reliant upon legislation and the threat of enforcement, together with physiological manipulation in order to get the public to comply.

However if Britain’s approach proves to be more effective, then (as I said) it’s reasonable to conclude that misleading the public and using fear / propaganda is OK and possibly advantageous.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Don’t be ridiculous.... It’s everything to do with what is under discussion... Have you actually watched the clip?
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What I saw was an unbalanced woman seconds away from exploding ranting that the government and the media should stop making announcements about virus hotspots and the number of people dying from the virus. You two might believe that "our Government and media has used propaganda, and fear in order to manipulate the public". In real life, people want to know these facts and want to know where the risks of infection are and want the government to lockdown outbreak areas and want the imbeciles to understand they can't do whatever they want. But, good luck to you and Denise in your campaign for an information blackout.
 
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Dont like the woman , but her narrative is spot on. The media is installling fear and hampering efforts to safely come out of this pandemic. Always choosing the lowest common denominator to get there point across. All the shite about schools, unions and teachers, and guess what? Kids are back at school and things are being managed. Like they could have been back in May, but the scaremongering put paid to that !.
If there is to be a national enquiry about this whole story, I hope tv and news companies are brought to boot about some of their shameful reporting.
 
Tangojoe said:
What I saw was an unbalanced woman seconds away from exploding ranting that the government and the media should stop making announcements about virus hotspots and the number of people dying from the virus. You two might believe that "our Government and media has used propaganda, and fear in order to manipulate the public". In real life, people want to know these facts and want to know where the risks of infection are and want the government to lockdown outbreak areas and want the imbeciles to understand they can't do whatever they want. But, good luck to you and Denise in your campaign for an information blackout.
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The Government acknowledged it used fear and propaganda to influence the public. It’s in the minutes from the strategy group meetings.

And it’s not about simply reporting the facts that Denise was taking issue with. It is the selective nature of the facts and the emphasis on the negative, as well as the focus on a single disease to the detriment of all others.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
The Government acknowledged it used fear and propaganda to influence the public. It’s in the minutes from the strategy group meetings.

And it’s not about simply reporting the facts that Denise was taking issue with. It is the selective nature of the facts and the emphasis on the negative, as well as the focus on a single disease to the detriment of all others.
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Well sometimes a healthy dose of fear can be a good thing.

Perhaps if the government and media had been more effective with the so called “scaremongering” we wouldn’t have had the BLM and FLA marches; the raves and the house parties; and the flocking onto Blackpool and Bournemouth beaches that people on here were complaining about at the time.

And fewer people would have died.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
And it’s not about simply reporting the facts that Denise was taking issue with. It is the selective nature of the facts and the emphasis on the negative, as well as the focus on a single disease to the detriment of all others.
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That's an interesting concept BFCx3. I can see the BBC announcement - Today 5 people in the UK died of coronavirus. However 50 in the Midlands died of heart attacks so the goverment will close down all KFC branches in Birmingham from tomorrow. There were 25 broken legs in Lancashire so sporting activities will be suspended there until further notice. On the positive side, most people remain in good health.

Hmmm not sure how that will work.
 
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