Racist Comment

Wizaard said:
They will be following a set template and won't have much say in the wording.

At the time, Tony Parr used the phrase 'discriminatory language'.
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You know this to be a fact that there’s a template all clubs have been issued with Wiz? Can you tell me where you know that from so I can check for myself please mate
 
Bloodtangerine said:
You know this to be a fact that there’s a template all clubs have been issued with Wiz? Can you tell me where you know that from so I can check for myself please mate
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Its like people want this to be true so they can slaughter fellow fans and propose life long bans and jail sentences

When its all proven to be bollux i hope the player get charged with bringing the game into disrepute
 
Bloodtangerine said:
The Club given all the bad publicity by itself saying something definitely happened without qualifying it in any way…..that’s poor
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I think the club are damned if they do and damned if they don't. I mean as an organisation they can hardly be seen to be saying "come on then prove it" to the media and football world. They have to be seen to be acting. But I agree with your posts from last night.
 
Bloodtangerine said:
You know this to be a fact that there’s a template all clubs have been issued with Wiz? Can you tell me where you know that from so I can check for myself please mate
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The way Tony read it out makes me think it has to be a prepared template. It's not the language anyone in normal life would use.

Try looking on the EFL website.
 
rememberlesshannon said:
I wasn't going to get involved with this, but I'm not going to let a " trial by Tony Parr " comment pass.
For those that don't know , if a player reports racist abuse there are protocols in place, the first being an announcement by the PA. In this case Tony Parr.
Second stage if it continues, the players are taken off for up to ten minutes before the game continues.
Third stage, match abandoned.

Dragging a " Tony Parr announcement " into it is poor form
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What I said earlier Wiz
 
So in summary

1. Forino definitely/probably misheard the comment. No evidence for that assertion but almost a cast iron certainty.
2. The police should never question potential suspects because that’s tantamount to finding them guilty without any court proceedings.
3. Other fans shouldn’t condemn racist comments (alleged or otherwise) because that’s also tantamount to finding someone (who no one knows) guilty without due process.
4. Forino should be charged with bringing the game into disrepute for apparently having crap hearing. Unless anyone is actually accusing him of lying?

Righto.
 
Mexboroseasider said:
So in summary

1. Forino definitely/probably misheard the comment. No evidence for that assertion but almost a cast iron certainty.
2. The police should never question potential suspects because that’s tantamount to finding them guilty without any court proceedings.
3. Other fans shouldn’t condemn racist comments (alleged or otherwise) because that’s also tantamount to finding someone (who no one knows) guilty without due process.
4. Forino should be charged with bringing the game into disrepute for apparently having crap hearing. Unless anyone is actually accusing him of lying?

Righto.
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A superior, look down on people post from you…..quelle surprise. It holds no water of course but don’t let that denigrate the merits of your effort

1) no one said he definitely/probably misheard. They said it was possible he may have
2) 3 Police and 5 Stewards….is that necessary to ask a man a question?
3) plenty of people will know the man surrounded by 8 people.
4) only Phil said that And not one person has accused the player of lying
 
Mexboroseasider said:
So in summary

1. Forino definitely/probably misheard the comment. No evidence for that assertion but almost a cast iron certainty.
2. The police should never question potential suspects because that’s tantamount to finding them guilty without any court proceedings.
3. Other fans shouldn’t condemn racist comments (alleged or otherwise) because that’s also tantamount to finding someone (who no one knows) guilty without due process.
4. Forino should be charged with bringing the game into disrepute for apparently having crap hearing. Unless anyone is actually accusing him of lying?

Righto.
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Or you can all just jump up and down shouting racists at people you don't know with absolutely no proof or evidence

I can't wait for all this to blow over with no fan being charged

Maybe you can start a thread on it saying you were wrong for jumping to ridiculous conclusions based on a half cocked knee jerk statement from the football club

I will watch this space
 
Bloodtangerine said:
A superior, look down on people post from you…..quelle surprise. It holds no water of course but don’t let that denigrate the merits of your effort

1) no one said he definitely/probably misheard. They said it was possible he may have
2) 3 Police and 5 Stewards….is that necessary to ask a man a question?
3) plenty of people will know the man surrounded by 8 people.
4) only Phil said that And not one person has accused the player of lying
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Well what evidence do you have that he “possibly” misheard.

Or is that just unsubstantiated speculation on your part based on…… sweet FA?
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
Or you can all just jump up and down shouting racists at people you don't know with absolutely no proof or evidence

I can't wait for all this to blow over with no fan being charged

Maybe you can start a thread on it saying you were wrong for jumping to ridiculous conclusions based on a half cocked knee jerk statement from the football club

I will watch this space
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No one is “shouting racist” at anyone in particular for the simple reason no specific individual has been accused, let alone named.

What they have done is condemn a racist comment made by someone. Why do you have such a problem with that?

And just because no one is charged doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It just means they didn’t catch the culprit.
 
Mexboroseasider said:
No one is “shouting racist” at anyone in particular for the simple reason no specific individual has been accused, let alone named.

What they have done is condemn a racist comment made by someone. Why do you have such a problem with that?

And just because no one is charged doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It just means they didn’t catch the culprit.
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You are saying it happened based on the club statement

I'm saying it didn't happen based on the accounts of several eye witnesses who I've known personally for over 30 years and also of the account from the police officer on duty

You crack on though i can't wait for the humble pie to be eaten
 
Bloodtangerine said:
I have no “evidence”…….more pertinently it appears the Police and Club don’t have any evidence Mex.
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Well neither of us know what the club do or don’t know. Or what they may find out.

And again, absence of evidence doesn’t prove it didn’t happen. It just means no one has come forward to corroborate what Forino heard.

Why would he make claim it unless he was absolutely sure what he’d heard? And why would he make it up?
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
You are saying it happened based on the club statement

I'm saying it didn't happen based on the accounts of several eye witnesses who I've known personally for over 30 years and also of the account from the police officer on duty

You crack on though i can't wait for the humble pie to be eaten
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So are these eye witnesses giving evidence to the club about what they saw/didn’t see? If not, why not?

And what was the number of this police officer who claims to know for certain no racist comment was made?
 
TSSeasider said:
@Bloodtangerine

I completely accept that user most circumstances, we have innocence until proven guilty as a fundamental right.

It's not quite the same with a hate crime.

"A hate crime is defined as 'Any criminal offence which is perceived by the victim or any other person, to be motivated by hostility or prejudice based on a person's race or perceived race; religion or perceived religion; sexual orientation or perceived sexual orientation; disability or perceived disability and any crime motivated by hostility or prejudice against a person who is transgender or perceived to be transgender.'

A hate incident is any incident which the victim, or anyone else, thinks is based on someone’s prejudice towards them because of their race, religion, sexual orientation, disability or because they are transgender.

Evidence of the hate element is not a requirement. You do not need to personally perceive the incident to be hate related. It would be enough if another person, a witness or even a police officer thought that the incident was hate related."

Now I don't know whether it was said; but the fact that the Wycombe player believes it was said it's all that is required.

So let's hope the person who did say it, is caught and put before the magistrates and appropriately punished.

As for lifetime bans; how about we do what the player says - a bit of education for them to realise just how hurtful and unnecessary this behaviour is.
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You've taken huge liberties with the definition there, there is absolutely no way simply perceiving you've been the victim of hate crime means the person you've accused has their rights forfeited. A hate crime goes through the exact same report/investigation/judicial process as any other crime does.

The difference is what is enough for a hate crime to be reported and considered a crime, the person perceiving they've been on the receiving end of a hate crime is enough. But it absolutely does not waver the accused's right to be innocent until proven guilty, or any other right they have. It would be despicable in a free and democratic society for that to be the case.

Someone only has to feel they've been victim and the person is automatically guilty? Surely you can't believe that? It is factually incorrect for a start.
 
Mexboroseasider said:
So are these eye witnesses giving evidence to the club about what they saw/didn’t see? If not, why not?

And what was the number of this police officer who claims to know for certain no racist comment was made?
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I have no idea and frankly i don't care, I'm just telling you what i heard from people who were there when the "alleged" incident happened

Far too many people have jumped to conclusions on this thread and its quite frankly embarrassing, oh and i include the club on that

Surely the club statement should have read that a player from Wycombe reported an alleged racist comment and the police and the club are investigating

That may have helped calm down the lynch mob
 
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Has the club said that it has CCTV evidence of the incident? or that multiple people heard the alleged racist abuse?
 
Shiggy said:
Has the club said that it has CCTV evidence of the incident? or that multiple people heard the alleged racist abuse?
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They have to act on the report from the player. What's so difficult to understand about that?

As such, they tannoyed the announcement we all heard, which is stage one of the EFL protocol.
 
Wizaard said:
They have to act on the report from the player. What's so difficult to understand about that?

As such, they tannoyed the announcement we all heard, which is stage one of the EFL protocol.
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At the time of the alleged incident, yes. I don't find that difficult to understand.

After that, surely it is the club's responsibility to establish the facts of the case?

Just a simple question.
 
Shiggy said:
At the time of the alleged incident, yes. I don't find that difficult to understand.

After that, surely it is the club's responsibility to establish the facts of the case?

Just a simple question.
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It is. Finding who said it is not the club's job though.
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
I'm saying it didn't happen based on the accounts of several eye witnesses who I've known personally for over 30 years and also of the account from the police officer on duty
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The old "but my mate said it, so it must be true" defence.

The only thing I can say with any certainty, having struggled through the entire thread, is that nobody really knows for sure what happened or was said.

The worry for me is that the FA are being given fresh evidence that we have a problem with fan behaviour at the club. And given the propensity for thrown mud to stick, it's the last thing the club wants or needs, I would have thought.
 
basilrobbie3 said:
The old "but my mate said it, so it must be true" defence.

The only thing I can say with any certainty, having struggled through the entire thread, is that nobody really knows for sure what happened or was said.

The worry for me is that the FA are being given fresh evidence that we have a problem with fan behaviour at the club. And given the propensity for thrown mud to stick, it's the last thing the club wants or needs, I would have thought.
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That’s why it’s important that all these witnesses who can apparently confirm no racist comment was made (including a police officer apparently) make themselves known to the club. So it can clear its name. You’d have thought they’d already have done so. Rather than just telling a mate.
 
basilrobbie3 said:
The old "but my mate said it, so it must be true" defence.

The only thing I can say with any certainty, having struggled through the entire thread, is that nobody really knows for sure what happened or was said.

The worry for me is that the FA are being given fresh evidence that we have a problem with fan behaviour at the club. And given the propensity for thrown mud to stick, it's the last thing the club wants or needs, I would have thought.
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I agree hence why the club should have probably chosen the words to their statement a bit more carefully given that it appears that there was only person in a crowd of 10,000 that heard anything racist
 
Mexboroseasider said:
That’s why it’s important that all these witnesses who can apparently confirm no racist comment was made (including a police officer apparently) make themselves known to the club. So it can clear its name. You’d have thought they’d already have done so. Rather than just telling a mate.
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And you would have thought that people wouldn't have been so quick to jump to conclusions

I will have you a charity bet of £500 that nobody gets convicted of this horrendous racist slur that was apparently made

Come on put your money where your mouth is, given you are so sure it happened

My charity of choice is Kick it Out

Come on
 
Bloodtangerine said:
Why?……is that your answer? Close down any debate where it doesn’t go exactly your way? Where there is a difference of opinion, perspective
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What makes you think I would desire that? It wasn't in the words I used. Neither have I messaged the Mods to request it. You seem a little jumpy for some reason.
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
I agree hence why the club should have probably chosen the words to their statement a bit more carefully given that it appears that there was only person in a crowd of 10,000 that heard anything racist
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He wasn’t even in the crowd…… he was on the pitch and probably further away than from where I was sat…….. oh and along with at least 20/30 others of us who also heard nothing
 
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